As an episode of limerence progresses, there is a notable shift in the nature of the experience. Early on, the giddy infatuation is glorious – enlivening, elating, euphoric. Later, the emotional landscape of limerence changes.
There often comes a point where we realise that the delirious highs of old have transformed into something much darker. An obsession with another person. A compulsive urge to contact them, to seek them, to think about them. A craving, rather than a liking.
That compulsion can last long past the point at which we know, intellectually, that the infatuation is doing us more harm than good.
Even if we have started to see beyond the idealisation of our limerent object – to see some of the tarnish on their halo – we remain spellbound. Hell, we can outright know that they are bad news, or have been playing us for fools, and we still stay hooked.
Why is it that we are still drawn to people who are unavailable? Why can’t we stop wanting someone who isn’t right for us?
There are some deep answers to those questions, to do with our personal histories and attachment styles, but as usual I’m going to focus on the neuroscience of what’s actually happening in our brains during that transition from euphoria to person addiction.
Withdrawal pains
The path into limerence is all about reward reinforcement. We feel fantastic when around our LOs, because they give us a glorious hit of arousal, excitement and romantic bonding. It’s not hard to fathom why we seek more.
That sort of positive reinforcement engrains a habit – when we spend time with LO, or think about LO, or plan our next chance to see them, we tighten the mental association between them and that wonderful feelgood neurochemical reward.
Run that process for too long, however, and a shift happens. Prolonged arousal is unsustainable. Being in a constant state of nervous tension is wearying. An ambiguous connection that never culminates into an honest relationship is frustrating and demoralising. After a while the inability to secure reward becomes stressful.
In the context of substance addiction, this is the problem of using a drug to the point of abuse. There are two components – tolerance (you need more drug to get the same effect) and dependence (your body adapts to the routine use of drug, and you suffer the discomfort of withdrawal if you try to stop).
The antireward trap
Some researchers call this phenomenon “antireward”. The idea is that, early on, positive reinforcement causes a habit to develop because you seek more pleasure. But, once you are addicted and the reward loses some of its potency, antireward kicks in.
It’s a horrible irony – when it felt good you want more, but once it starts to feel bad… you still want more. Antireward is the aversive drive when you fear losing a source of reward. It’s not just that your brain’s reward circuits are quietening down, new stress-related circuits are also firing up.
Antireward is partly neuronal (from the amygdala, principally) but also hormonal (cortisol, principally). You don’t just passively lose the high, you have an active low, urging you to get motivated and recover the reward you’ve lost.
Antireward drives negative reinforcement. Securing relief from the negative feelings becomes yet another drive that entrains the LO-seeking habit.
Why does this happen?
It’s the million dollar question in addiction research – why are some habits so addictive, and why are some people more vulnerable?
The answer, of course, is: it’s complicated. In the context of limerence, though, I think there are some clues.
First, uncertainty seems essential. You have to stay in that prolonged state of heightened romantic arousal and anticipation past the point of straightforward gratification. If your LO reciprocates or flatly rejects you, then you have a natural resolution. If you have barriers that prevent honest expression of feelings, or another cause of uncertainty that leaves you in a state of limbo, your overarousal is more likely to turn into stress and antireward.
More bluntly: uncertainty is stressful.
Second, we heap a lot of hope onto our LOs. Even if this isn’t conscious – we don’t have to be intentionally seeking them as a life partner – the drive to bond with a mate is incredibly powerful and motivating. That means the loss of hope when we start to feel the possibility of success slipping away is equally powerful.
Most people can cope with the aversive pang of losing a bonus at work, or foregoing a delicious cake, but limerence is a whole other matter. The magnitude of reward will decide the magnitude of antireward, and so the pain of loss is correspondingly greater.
When loss of a reward feels disastrous, we desperately try everything we can to avoid it. And limerence is one of the most exhilarating experiences that anyone can go through. The antireward of losing the promise of so much bliss is a real kick in the guts.
What can be done?
The route out of this trap is to focus your attention on what’s really going on. Your limerent brain is an unsophisticated creature, driven by short-term urges, but your executive brain knows better. The fleeting relief from limerence-antireward through reverie, social media stalking, happy memory curation, or LO contact, is an illusion that is making things worse and strengthening the addiction. So you have to stop.
Don’t underestimate the importance of properly understanding your situation. The pain of antireward isn’t going to stop easily, and it will get worse before it gets better (especially if you just go cold-turkey), but it will pass eventually. Your goal is to hold your course through that bad road of pain until normal feelings are re-established – until your reward and antireward systems return to a healthy equilibrium.
You need to accept that this isn’t going to be easy and pain free. You’re going to have to show some grit, and some stoicism. The heart of the issue is that the antireward systems need soothing – you need ways of reducing the impact of the loss of hope and better ways to calm your troubled emotions.
You need better rewards. This is why I advocate purposeful living as the foundation of recovery. Limerence is a massive life event, and you need something on the same sort of scale to counter it. Taking the decision to properly examine your life, transform it, and strive for a better future that you really believe in, comes close. It’s a way of redirecting the energy of limerence into a program of self-development, a way of getting some lasting good from the emotional upheaval.
Deep limerence isn’t something that can be overturned by wishful thinking, waiting, and just hoping it was solve itself. You need something profound to motivate you, to inspire you to look beyond the old, overfamiliar and counterproductive coping strategies.
You need to set your mind to recovery, and really go for it.
“ Antireward is the aversive drive when you fear losing a source of reward. It’s not just that your brain’s reward circuits are quietening down, new stress-related circuits are also firing up… You don’t just passively lose the high, you have an active low.”
I needed this blog post today. The comedown from the end of my mutual LE has been so depressing and demoralizing despite months and months of intentional NC, working on myself, and understanding that LO is bad news. It has felt way deeper than just missing a reward source .. an active low makes much more sense.
“The pain of antireward isn’t going to stop easily, and it will get worse before it gets better (especially if you just go cold-turkey), but it will pass eventually.”
I wish someone could have a crystal ball and tell me when it will completely pass. I am working on myself, the pain is decreasing, but recovery is taking so much of my energy and it’s still not complete. Feeling exhausted and drained mentally and spiritually.
Sorry to hear this Reader, but yeah, that’s pretty much the reality of the comedown. It’s impossible to know how long it will last, but I really do believe that it will be a lot shorter if you have a positive goal to work towards (based on improving your own life, and not on LO).
Reader,
“I wish someone could have a crystal ball and tell me when it will completely pass.”
I’ve been NC for two years and two months. I vacillated from missing him to being angry at him for leading me on, which he did. But within the last month, I’ve moved into a new phase of anger (still at him) but mostly disbelief (at myself) that I wasted so much time and energy on such a hopeless, ridiculous situation. I took what everyone else saw as a simple tune (some random, married dude flirting with me) and turned it into an entire symphony in my mind.
Are you inside my head? Everything you wrote resonates with me right now. Can I ask if there’s anything that’s helping you with the anger? My anger is so intense. I’ve had no direct contact with my LO for 8 months. I had avoided indirect contact for close to 2 months but recently slipped and looked at social media. I’m back to not looking again. I am angry at him, and I’m angry at myself for the reasons you mentioned. What was I thinking? How could I waste so much of my life on this situation? The limerence started almost 2 years ago, and the pain is still so intense, but the anger is really eating away at me these days.
Welcome to the “What was I thinking?” phase of limerence recovery! Somewhere in the past blogs there’s a discussion of Hugh Grant and what he was thinking.
Anger is one of the 5 stages of grief. Poke around the blogs long enough and you’ll see quite a bit of self-loathing. It seems to be an inevitable part of the process.
Do a word search for “stupid” in the comments and some of them will return a lot of hits, some none at all. The answer to “What was I thinking?” pretty much comes down to “It seemed like a really good idea at the time.”
It may take awhile but it will pass.
I had the same experience. It was going on for 14 years….
@Marcia.
Do you think the anger limerents feel has something to do with hidden/buried feelings of humiliation? I.e. is the anger an indirect response to feeling humiliated in some way by the whole situation?
One of my LOs even explicitly said to me: “No hard feelings?” And, at the time, I had no idea what he was talking about. I mean, I wasn’t even aware I had strong feeling for him of a romantic nature, so I didn’t have any hard feelings toward him at that stage – none that I was consciously aware of. Although I did have a lot of dreams where super-unpleasant things kept happening to him… 😆
Basically, my LO suspected I had feelings for him. But I wasn’t able or willing to admit to myself I might have feelings for him. I’ve come a long way since those days. I must have been very emotionally repressed?
I think when I feel angry at an LO, I’m just running away from what I’m really feeling, which is the pain of humiliation plain and simple…
Let’s break down the situation: I like someone a lot. Someone doesn’t like me a lot. End result: I feel humiliated. Anger then helps me feel less humiliated, but doesn’t really address the root cause of why I feel so humiliated in the first place. I mean, what is there to be humiliated about? Surely rejection – even rejection in love – is a common and fairly mundane feature of human social life? 🤔
Is humiliation a rational emotional response to rejection? Or is it some ridiculous, over-the-top, inappropriate, irrational response to rejection? Do only emotionally-repressed people struggle with humiliation? Do women feel humiliated too, or is it more of a male response to things? 🤔
Come to think of it, an article on the psychology of humiliation might be fascinating… Topic suggestion: “Why do human beings experience (and fear) humiliation?” 😉
“Do only emotionally-repressed people struggle with humiliation? Do women feel humiliated too, or is it more of a male response to things?”
Interesting question! I think humiliation is universal… men vs women, open vs repressed, rich vs poor. Humiliation is by far my biggest fear! And past humiliations have a nasty habit of repeating uninvited in your mind, thus reinforcing the fear.
I am guessing humiliation, and shame in general, gave prehistoric humans a survival advantage by encouraging individuals to adhere to social conventions and to work to stay in others’ good graces, thus promoting a group’s social cohesion and well-being.
The solution to humiliation of course is to invite it in, take every opportunity to be rejected, play the clown, have people laugh at you and laugh along with them. It never feels quite as bad in reality than the anticipatory fear of it does.
For me the anger is definitely about humiliation and I’m a woman. And humiliation’s close buddy shame – that life force killing sense of unworthiness. So we get angry because getting angry is a better state to be in than shame. It has some power. I recently had an LE with a doctor I had to see for a time. I mean good grief! I clocked that he was attractive first meeting and then I got so scared that I’d get limerent and be therefore humiliated, as I have with past LEs, that it sort of became a self fulfilling prophesy. Weird thing is I think he was limerent on me too. Could be wrong there. But of course with professional boundaries he has to set limits and my last consult with him with another person present was extremely humiliating and now I am angry and having fantasies about confronting this guy bla bla! You have to see the funny side though. It’s just so absurd. BUT I will NEVER go back even though I’m supposed to go for a check up in a year. The experience was just so aversive. Which I suppose at the end of the day compromises my health care to an extent because he did my surgery but there are other doctors out there if anything goes wrong. So that ain’t funny! What a curse is limerence!
I just want to add to my post that I did not flirt or make suggestive comments or any other inappropriate behaviour. I did act a little high spirited to hide my anxiety so maybe that was the problem? Maybe it looked like flirting?
@Reader and the world
I have been NC for many years but loneliness triggered my LE. I came to this blog, definitely helped but not as much.
Marcia’s comment “the door that was never open” was beautiful.
Anyway, subsequent to this, I ended up speaking with a couple of other exes and girls I was interested in. Was wonderful to connect with them and learn about their lives. I wasn’t having an EA or even hoping for PA. It just made me happy that they are all wonderful mothers and their parenting is helping build wonderful lives.
I wished all that happiness for my LO (my first ex) and try forgetting her every time she pops into my head. Marcia’s comment definitely helps. Reminds me that we never really had anything.
There are still many issues my marriage has and needs fixing. I need to work on how I treat my wife and she, me. But I know now that it has to be done.
Lastly, I am positive that this LE isnt going to Go away. It will fade. I am just going to have to manage it a long, long time
I’m sorry to read this Reader, in my experience the pain I feel is about much more than just LO, it’s also about other losses in my life, my attachment style and sometimes I feel like I’m crying out the tears of generations, my grandmother was a troubled person who never had therapy, I actually believe I’m doing the grief work for more than just me.
Try to look al little things that maybe have improved in the last months.
Now is the time to mold your life to how you want it, is there something you always wanted to do?
Oh yes – I feel exactly the same, now it’s not so much about my LO, but about other grief and loss, some that I feel is mine and others! Continuing on the road to recovery – keep moving forward, step by step, day by day. 🥰
I relate so much of what you are saying. I do feel I am also crying over past generations traumas and old old things that don’t even belong to him. I always had this deep sorrow and heaviness inside..as kid… I feel my LO came to trigger something that goes way deeper than he and I. That being said, does not make the pain go away. But I am relieved and happy to see that I am not the only one to feel that
This antireward idea is really interesting and consistent with my experience also. Wanting to end a low is why my mind creates elaborate potential LO scenarios even though I know deep down that they are no longer consistent with reality, highly unlikely and will ultimately lead to disappointment and pain. Limerence is a such a closed, self-fuelling mind loop isn’t it!
Having a purposeful life has not killed my LE at all. Finding something that delights me the way LO does… there just isn’t anything else quite like that for me. But it does give me the security of knowing that however difficult NC would be, the pain will only be temporary, it will end the rollercoaster and I will be absolutely fine over time as my life is pretty good. That is a real comfort.
I do believe that removing uncertainty can be helpful also in getting over LOs thus is worth pursuing at least once. Either by our own decisive and determined choices or by our LOs. I am noting to myself though that it is better not to rely on LO for this as it puts my happiness into someone else’s hands.
Very well put, Allie. That’s it exactly – there is solace in purposeful living that makes the pain more tolerable while you push through it.
” I am noting to myself though that it is better not to rely on LO for this as it puts my happiness into someone else’s hands.”
That’s incorrect. You can’t put your happiness into someone else’s hand. You can actively or passively allow someone to contribute or detract from your happiness.
But, it is, and always will be, your happiness.
You are taking my words too literally LE. We are actually saying exactly the same thing.
“Prolonged arousal is unsustainable. Being in a constant state of nervous tension is wearying. An ambiguous connection that never culminates into an honest relationship is frustrating and demoralising. After a while the inability to secure reward becomes stressful.”
That nervous tension is truly exhausting. It burned through all my resources until in the end I just wanted it to stop and going no-contact felt like a relief, even though I still craved the object of my limerent desire.
Things are better now that equilibrium has been restored. I’m left with a sadness for the stress and pain I put myself through, but mostly just so glad it’s now in the past and I’m armed with greater self knowledge and a better chance of avoiding any future limerent experiences. I’m grateful that this site exists as it helped me to make sense of what had happened to me, gave it a name and showed me that there are plenty of other people who have or are having the same sort of experience.
For me the worst thing about being limerent is that I have been happily married cruising along for many years – then BOOM out of nowhere comes the overwhelming desire to spend eternity with my LO. Talk about extreme,
I cannot even physically see my LO as she is so vulnerable health-wise. She keeps telling me on WhatsApp voice messages as she is too ill to type that she is blessed to have met me, I have a wonderful soul, I am a wonderful dear friend etc. Recently we have exchanged hearts and flowers emojis in the middle of the night and she sends me emails to my work email address with loving emojis. She just started sending me hearts out of the blue the other afternoon.
She knows I am married – my wife put me in touch with her to help her out 🤯 maybe she just wants me to help her for free but I would do that anyway LO or not.
She seems to be limerent for me from her behaviour. I just feel I need to communicate with her emotionally every day (if not every hour, minute, second). I just don’t understand why someone as vivacious, transcendent, gorgeous, young (-er than me – significantly)beautiful, connected, creative and in the public eye is spending copious amounts of her limited time (she sleeps 16 hours a day and is in constant pain) communicating with me through whatsapp voice messages, text messages, zoom meetings, emails. I am very confused, bowled over, extremely worried about my long-term relationship. Its a bit of a mess – don’t think I can divulge to LO as she may reciprocate or – even worse – may just tell me to buzz off 🤣
You are a person. She is a person. When your in limerence she is awesome, god-like, nearly perfect even, cause that is what you see in that state. But no one is perfect. Everyone is a person. Just like you. She has flaws, just like everyone. She spending her time with you, because she wants too. Thats it. There are no leagues, there are just people.
You don’t want to be perfect, or her to be perfect. If she was then she would have nowhere to grow, nowhere to go, she would be finished.
Well put – I agree with you.
I haven’t been on the blog much recently (mostly hanging out in the forum) but saw the topic and, like @reader said, I needed this. A bit more than two weeks out from the sudden end of a lengthy EA with my LO, I struggle most of each day with how to stop wanting him.
“…we heap a lot of hope onto our LOs. Even if this isn’t conscious – we don’t have to be intentionally seeking them as a life partner – the drive to bond with a mate is incredibly powerful and motivating. That means the loss of hope when we start to feel the possibility of success slipping away is equally powerful.” I did not begin to understand how much hope I was heaping onto mine until it ended, because it some ways there seemed to be no uncertainty whatsoever. He was into me, made it clear, I had no doubts about that.
Turns out what was uncertain, since we are both married, is what would be done about it. Now on this side of it, I believe I had a (mostly) subconscious hope he would leave his SO and “rescue” me from mine. He hinted at that repeatedly. But when his SO discovered the EA, he cut me off immediately and I was suddenly, acutely, painfully aware of the loss of hope.
What I’m wondering is does it matter for recovery if it was a one-sided LE or if it was mutual? Like if a relationship existed, with daily time together and acknowledged feelings and all that, do you still approach recovery like a straight LE? Like it’s an addiction? Lots of EA advice says to both cut it off like an addiction but also “take time to grieve the loss” which really confuses me. Anytime I allow my brain to touch a memory of him for more than a couple seconds I feel right back in the grip.
I would approach it like a straight LE, like it’s an addiction. I would think of him but ONLY to think of his faults; the ways he made you feel unvalued, shame, or humiliated. The cruel and disrespectful breakup he gave you. So both phrases are true: it is an absolute addiction that you need to cut off both physical contact from this person and cut off thinking of them in any way except focusing on the crappy parts of them. AND it’s going to take time to grieve the loss because there were some good parts of them, plus both your feelings and the relationship were real.
I also recommend doing ho’oponopono meditation for letting someone go. I stumbled across it online while I was trying to find something, anything to end the pain. Now whenever I feel that familiar longing/anguish I lay down, turn on the meditation, and let the tears come. It honestly has cut out so much pain and, in my opinion, really accelerated the grieving process. I use the meditation once every three or four days now, whereas in the beginning I was using it multiple times a day.
This is the one I use:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=atkmzmEUAZo&t=782s
Good luck.
I got a question for everyone. Have any of you ever experienced limerence when you have had a happy relationship with very little problems and your general life has been going ok or good as well?
Hi, my answer is yes I am experiencing limerence currently. I have been in a stable relationship for years and my life is good, I am well, my job is good, I have a loving family and friends. But the powerful cataclysmic force of romantic yearning has crashed into my life destroying my emotional stability. I was not seeking romance or change but it feels like they are being forced upon me through circumstance. I know I could/should reject my LO but she is extremely unwell and I do not want to make her health any worse – I am prolonging the agony but that is what we do right – otherwise we would not be limerent.
My response is “No.”
Of my 4 LEs, only one came after I was married/unavailable and there were things going on in my life that I think made me receptive to an LE/EA. By way of bad analogy, my discontent/dissatisfaction was the bed of soil that the LE sprouted in.
Of the LEs before I got married, I was actively looking for a relationship when I encountered my LOs.
Yes I have. I was happy and content when I fell into the limerence rabbit hole. My life was not perfect of course (who’s ever is!) but SO and I were close and content together, work was going well, family life was good and I had friends and interests. And most of all I was happy within myself.
Saying the above though, my limerence and this site have pushed me to make improvements to my life so it is now more interesting and varied, thus giving me more to think about other than just LO.
This was my situation too, almost exactly.
Yes! Three times. My husband is incredible and he doesn’t deserve my stupidity. Thankfully, I do not act on my limerence.
LO#1 caused marriage problems because I started to prefer him over my husband.
LO#2 strengthened my marriage because it pulled me out of a clinical depression, made me more likable and sent my libido through the roof.
LO#3 is new and harmless so far. If it gets dangerous, I’ll go no contact. I’m not at the intrusive thoughts phase yet.
I have been on this site for a week now, stumbled across it when googling ‘lovesickness’ (I think similar to another contributor here) and it’s as if all the jigsaw pieces have come together all at once.
I read an article each day, going over the various comments, and I think and ponder over my last 4-some decades and count the various LE’s and LO’s and what not.
My SO of 24 years was an LO of sorts too – from what I have understood. The difference was were we both young, single and after a number of years of developing a fabulous friendship (for me it was immediate soulmate and he’s the one) we married and 16years on, with two kids, living a wonderful life together. I have no problems connecting with my SO, and prior to getting on this website I would have said we have a perfectly ordinary life interspersed with special moments.
A few days back, I decided to disclose my current situation to SO. I know he knows me inside out, knew exactly who I was talking about as I started explaining about limerence and waited patiently for me to say the LO’s name out loud. He could not have been more understanding, and more compassionate (or was it dismissive?). He helped me understand that I have done this type of ‘thing’ with celebrities, musicians etc. So from his pov, it happens, I get over it, move on, this is nothing to worry about. I hope so too.
The difference from my last few LO’s, this one is live and kicking, a part of our lives – LO works for him, and I help out my SO in his business. It is all fabulously muddled, and my NC, just about a week old, is bound to fail as keeping contact (watching the security cameras, creatings shifts, HR stuff, communicating) is what I need to do, workwise.
So why has my current LE occured, and why did my brain need to find an LO? I have been thinking very very hard to understand myself.
Can I perhaps overshare a bit here —— in the hope of finding some answers.
I have the most fantastic sex life with SO when I am smack in the middle of an LE. I have counted 4 LO’s during my married life and everytime it’s the same story.
Right now, I am in the typical slump that everyone who has started NC is talking about here. I am upset at the LO for going on about his work like nothing’s happened. I should back up and say, the only thing that ever happened was meeting of the eyes across the room multiple times, and then me sending cheeky texts on a handful of seperate occasions to which the replies were guarded and straight forward and not at all misleading. LO is considerably younger than me, in a committed relationshiop as well, and in many ways so much more mature than I am.
As Dr L states, I know this is all in my head, but gosh it feels like it’s something real and tangible. Reading back what I’ve written, I sound like a 13 yr old. But even this realisation doesn’t stop all the feelings from being felt.
Why do I need this feeling of real and tangible when I have it with SO? Or am I doomed to only have a great physical relationship with SO only during an LE?
My theory [and I’m not a mental health professional] is that LEs enliven us and that spills over. So, it’s not all that surprising that things ramp up when we’re in one. My last LE filled me with anxiety and dread but I definitely wasn’t bored. I had a dream about LO #4 in which I almost drove my car off a cliff. I didn’t need a gypsy to figure that one out. I’d wake up in the middle of the night and feel like she was in the room. LO #4 was 2500 miles away. I’d check my phone and see an email from her had come in 5 minutes before. My phone was on Silent and in another room.
I don’t feel that way anymore.
Now, as long as it’s being handled appropriately and your SO’s onboard with things, you can try to ride the wave. You know the pattern, make it work for you. The risk is sometimes things change and things can get away from you. The kicker is something can change on their side and things can unravel. Something in your LO’s life goes south and it’s a whole new ballgame. And, it can happen rapidly. One minute things are perking along fairly smoothly and the next minute, it’s “Holy Sh-t!” My LE went into overdrive after LO #4’s partner allegedly cheated on her, physically assaulted her, and she reached out to me. Things became very real.
If you do try to ride the wave, check out https://livingwithlimerence.com/can-limerence-be-safely-harnessed/
If you want to figure out why that’s the pattern, you might need a pro and that digging might go pretty deep. You’ll need someone who knows what they’re doing and not all therapists are up to the challenge. Then again, it could all be pretty superficial. You won’t know until you look.
How much is it affecting your life and is it worth the effort trying to figure it out? Only you can answer that. However, you should never ask a question that you’re not willing to hear the answer to.
Dr. L,
I’ve been doing research for over a year trying to figure out the dynamics of my last relationship and how profoundly it still continues to affect me and my sons.
Today is the first time I have come across the terminal limerence and I definitely experienced this in the beginning of the relationship. When reading comments from others on numerous articles there are many things that sound so familiar to my experience, beliefs/values or my upbringing. I’m searching for answers to many questions so that I never go through another relationship like this. The limerence I experienced feels like the first red flag that I ignored that ultimately led me into a relationship that continues to cause me so much pain.
Could you please explain to me the difference between trauma bonding with bread crumbing in a cluster B relationship and limerence? Limerence sounds very similar and hearing people on this site romanticize this limerent experience makes me want to reach out and worn them how dangerous it can potentially be. I understand everyone’s experience is different but mine has not been pleasant and continues to affect me and my children a year offer I have ended the relationship. Although I ended the relationship and went no contact before I even understood what had happened or what a cluster B personality was, we are still completely under his control. My youngest son is still trauma bonded to him, has suicidal ideation from the abandonment and I struggle occasionally. However, now that I can see through to the reality of the situation and that he was simply telling me everything I needed/wanted to hear, I know that my limerence was an obsession with an illusion. Our relationship was not real. He became the person that I needed and wanted in my life through deceit and manipulation. In the end, he became the person he promised he would protect us from.
Because I have only experienced limerence in this relationship, I was trying to determine if it was a precursor or red flag to a dysfunctional relationship with someone with sociopathic or narcissistic traits. I’m also trying to figure out what is lacking in me that would choose and contributed to this whole dysfunctional dynamic. My sons and I feel completely conned. Any comments would be appreciated.
Hi Janet,
I hope you are finding answers to your questions. I have two close relatives who display cluster B symptoms. They can leave me feeling broken and questioning what is real. It is hard to be in a relationship with them. I’m not surprised that you are still searching for answers a year later. I wish I could answer your questions.
I don’t know “… the difference between trauma bonding with bread crumbing in a cluster B relationship and limerence?”
I suspect trauma bonding in a romantic relationship requires limerence, but limerence certainly doesn’t require a trauma bond. You can have limerence for a respectable, lovely person. Many of the commenters on this website are limerent for good-intentioned LOs. I think there is an article about narcissistic LOs in the blog archives that might answer your question.
I’m sorry you were entangled with that man. I wish you luck to find answers to your questions and strength to continue living a good life even if you don’t get answers.
Have you considered that there is nothing wrong with you, and any reasonable person would have responded to that man’s seduction in a comparable way? I hope you’ll give yourself some compassion during this process.
Browsing the net in an attempt to get some kind of cure for my lingering infatuation led me here. Being a married man with kids and approaching my 40s it ties in to the middle age crisis cliche, but god damn! Working with my newfownd LO for 3 weeks basically closed of in a room together was the most excitement I’ve had for a while. The butterflies and nervousness, studying her eyes and body language for any kind of cues, and the way she’d completely light up at times when I managed a modicum of charm became my new high.
She’s married too and the way my brain is constantly searching for hints is exhausting. It’s like she’s the entire world there to judge my value. Every flaw of mine goes through the filter of what I think she might be thinking.
Been going no contact except for when we cross paths, but as soon as I catch a glimpse it’s back to square one.
So many old insecurities and self-loathing seem to be bubbling to the surface as if I’m going through some kind of inquisition.
Oh man, that is hard. Are you still working in close quarters? That sounds like torture. I’m very fortunate to have physical distance from my LO. You have my sympathy.
I hope you’ll take time to read through the articles about how to get over your LO. There are many helpful suggestions and the comments help, too. No contact combined with a new LO is what ultimately ended my intrusive thoughts. The LOs constant presence in my mind was just awful. I also had to stop indulging in reverie about the LO. Oh, and a family vacation interrupted my routine, which also helped. My new LO hasn’t caused problems yet and I’m hopeful to keep enough distance that this LE doesn’t blossom into the full-blown miserable experience like last time.
I warn against disclosing to the LO. Don’t do it! When they reciprocate, life gets very difficult. If they reject you, the LE might blow over. I don’t know, that’s never happened to me. I’ve had men disclose feelings for me which I’ve rejected, and it just leaves me with a creepy, unsafe feeling when I’m around them. I don’t see value in disclosing to LO.
Good luck, friend. Remember that these feelings will pass.
Especially when working so closely. A relevant post:
https://livingwithlimerence.com/when-not-to-disclose/
Hi all so I’m very new to all this normally I am one of those people that stay quite and just read but today i just need to say my story maybe it will help who knows .So back story my LO is my former manger she’s a lady married with 4 kids Alot older then me I’m 28 heaven knows why I became so obsessed with her iv never really been like this before so it’s difficult for me to understand my self at this point .we worked closes at one point last year and we used to txt out of work just formal work stuff she doesn’t know how I feel although I have hinted it a few time but she ignored it she’s never flirted with me if anything she’s always been sarcastic with me but she is always willing to help me out and listen to me when I approach her Im sure she doesn’t feel the same I mean she’s married! I keep trying to get her attention It’s now becoming embarrassing I feel sick sometimes because of the way I feel about her and how desperate I’ve become for her to just acknowledge me, I’m struggling to just let her go and move on I have so many other options but I just don’t find them interesting I keep trying to keep away 6 months back changed my number went NC was kind of feeling better then ended up talking again due to a common friend when we reconnected I thought it would be different this time she offered to meet she actually was paying attention to my problems and me then she went MIA again stopped talking to me it’s all very confusing currently have removed her from my WhatsApp so I can’t see her and am trying to focus on my self if anyone has any useful tips it would be highly appreciated
Hi Sonia, you sound like you are really suffering, so sorry about that. Being married myself, with a younger LO, I can tell you that if someone is married, they will always be erratic. If one of her 4 kids has an earache, she will be MIA. If her SO’s family is coming to stay, she’ll be MIA. Basically, a married person’s time is spoken for. What she can spare you, is whatever is left behind. Even if she likes you “that way” she will find it hard to devote time to you; and definitely if she does NOT like you “that way” you will be a lower priority than her family, and this is a reality with a married LO. It’s hard when you know you have many other options but you are obsessed with this unavailable person, who you are obsessed with because of limerence. I have no answer for you, but it sounds like you are trying NC (and of course it is hard, two steps forward, one back) but I am guessing because of work you cannot avoid her completely. Look up Dr L’s advice on “deprogramming”: https://livingwithlimerence.com/how-to-get-rid-of-limerence/
Such a wonderful article and blog. It has saved me from diving even more deeply into my obsession with LO and his social media profiles. I was NC with LO for 8 months but, as he’s an artist, he released new stuff so I stumbled upon a friend’s Instagram talking about his stuff. In a few days, I was back on LO’s Instagram and, at the beginning, it felt awesome.
However, after a few days, I felt pain and struggle and, for the first time in my life, I realized that obsessing about him is very hurtful to me and I just stopped. Since I’ve been NC, my mind has finally started relaxing. I feel much happier now and it’s as if my identity is not tight to LO (I always felt that) but to me, my awesome self.
What helped my decision to go NC?
Sincerely, your article ‘The worst case of limerence I’ve ever seen.’ I am the woman who would be married and meet a ‘soul mate’ in a bar and think she has found the love she was always looking for, the thing that completely changed her life. I have a similar inner speech, I’m very poetic in my thoughts for a LO.
So, when I read what the guy in the bar was actually thinking about the woman suffering from limerence, I realized that perhaps, or most certainly my own LO thinks/feel the same.
Moreover, I have probably projected all my fantasies and desires about being loved on poor LO. In reality, he probably doesn’t think about me or worse, he’s fighting his own demons with trauma, mental health issues and day-to-day problems like I am and he just wants to fall in love and be happy like all of us.
But, since he never let me know he’s serious about his feelings for me(he just said he likes me so much but never wanted a relationship), I assume he’s not interested. And I need to accept it and move the fuck on.
Oh but if it was that easy. 🙂
Well, NC is going well. It will be horrible once I’ll again stumble upon a promo pic with him on social media but hopefully, I won’t fall off the wagon then.
Will definitely check in with this blog often since it seems to be helpful.
Many thanks.
For me, these are the three paragraphs in the article that stand out the most:
“Run that process for too long, however, and a shift happens. Prolonged arousal is unsustainable. Being in a constant state of nervous tension is wearying. An ambiguous connection that never culminates into an honest relationship is frustrating and demoralising. After a while the inability to secure reward becomes stressful.”
“Antireward is partly neuronal (from the amygdala, principally) but also hormonal (cortisol, principally). You don’t just passively lose the high, you have an active low, urging you to get motivated and recover the reward you’ve lost.”
“When loss of a reward feels disastrous, we desperately try everything we can to avoid it. And limerence is one of the most exhilarating experiences that anyone can go through. The antireward of losing the promise of so much bliss is a real kick in the guts.”
I think at least one of my former LOs did give me a clear “no thanks”. The problem was I was in denial about having feelings for him in the first place, which means I couldn’t emotionally process his rejection. (What was he rejecting? I hadn’t made any overtures. How can one reject some overture that hasn’t even been made?)
I think this guy just sensed my “weird energy” and felt repelled by it. Fair enough. Makes sense now…
Also, irritatingly, this guy STILL wanted to be very close friends with me, after pre-emptively rejecting me. Now that’s what I call immaturity (on his part). Realistically, I needed a bit of time away from him at that point. We needed to put any genuine friendship we had on ice.
Ah, the benefits of hindsight and the joys of wisdom gained long after the fact. Still, I’m relieved to learn I’m (apparently) not crazy. 😛
What can I do to stop wanting to be limerent? I can’t draw the line between the over-affectionate and normal loving feelings. I don’t want to stop being utterly infatuated with them, but I don’t want them to occupy my mind as much. Really what I’m asking is how can I stop seeing my limerence as love?
Realize that they are a normal human being. LO is an angel. Literally come down from the heavens to bless us all. LO isn’t perfection. No wait she is. No she isn’t. Seeing LO as an imperfect human is the best pathway to getting out of limerence. No one wants to admit it. LO is human? It’s been a damn year since LO left my life and I am still struggling. And there other posters here that have struggled letting go of a LO for much longer. Person addiction. The perfect explanation for limerence. I crave LO as much as I crave the bottle of vodka I am attempting to empty right now.
Evan, I struggle with this one myself.
You write that you don’t want to stop being utterly infatuated with them.
That would be the dopamine LO obviously supplies, tricking you into thinking it’s love. When infact it’s not.
My good friend, Speedwagon said this in another post.
“Remember, limerence is happening in your head and your perception is altered. Try hard to view things as they really are and not let the limerence distort the reality.”
Hope this helps you out.
I am rereading Dr L’s words over and over:
“Antireward is the aversive drive when you fear losing a source of reward …
Antireward is partly neuronal (from the amygdala, principally) but also hormonal (cortisol, principally). You don’t just passively lose the high, you have an active low, urging you to get motivated and recover the reward you’ve lost. Antireward drives negative reinforcement. Securing relief from the negative feelings becomes yet another drive that entrains the LO-seeking habit.”
I think this idea of “antireward” and “active low” bears more exploration in this journey to get over person addiction. I would say anti is 95% of most people’s limerence experience. The high was in the initial part; the rest of it is this state of active low, where we fight the urge to self-soothe. Best ideas to calm down the amygdala and disperse the cortisol?
How To Let Go of Someone: The Trick to Releasing Someone From Your Heart (3:18)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UnWlRSpNRdk
What Is True No Contact: How To Kill the Hope (4:37)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D4JC4yokwwU
I’ve never watched this man’s channel before. The first video came up in my youtube suggestions. But he right. Especially the second video. Not calling or contacting her is only one part of no contact. If I can’t cut her off emotionally than I am only making superficial progress. Not contacting her for the sake of her relationship. Not contacting her for the sake of my relationship. But if I can’t kill the hope and sever the emotional place in my heart she resides in than what kind of actual meaningful progress am I making?
Last night I fell asleep on the recliner watching TV. Early in the morning around 2am I felt something crawling on my skin and jumped out the chair. I couldn’t find what it was so I threw the cover in the dryer to kill whatever it was. I sat back on the edge of the recliner, head hanging and hands clutched together. My wife looks over at me and do you know what she asked me? “What’s wrong? Intrusive thoughts again?” I told her no, that there was something in the chair crawling on me. I guess she can tell I am still struggling.