One of the more painful scenarios that limerents have to deal with is when their limerence avatar is “unavailable people”.
I’ve written before about the challenges of unavailable LOs. It’s a psychologically rich topic, and I recently came across this video from the School of Life that has a rather caustic view of the subject:
There’s a lot of interesting stuff here, and anyone who is beginning to practice purposeful living is well advised to analyse their own behaviour and see if they are, at some level, deliberately self-sabotaging to avoid the harrowing vulnerability of an authentic relationship.
However, I would add a couple of counterpoints to this perspective – specific to limerents and the psychology of infatuation.
1. The barrier may cause the limerence
Barriers and uncertainty are potent amplifiers of limerence. It might be the case that your limerence avatar really is “unavailable people” because of abandonment fears or desire for the familiar security of a fantasy relationship, but it could also be the case that limerence only occurs because of the unavailability.
If you feel the glimmer for someone available, the progress of any romantic connection can be relatively smooth – you check each other out, see whether you hit it off, and then either get together (ecstatic union) or get rejected (emotional pain). Either way, both of these pathways should neutralise any uncertainty and so would tend to diminish the limerence. In contrast, if you happen to feel the glimmer for someone who is unavailable, these options are not open. There is no way to discharge the tension, and the limerence escalates.
Even worse, if the barrier that makes the person unavailable is itself Romantic (or can be interpreted that way), then adversity will also heighten the limerence. Let’s say that LO is married, but desperately unhappy, or has just been posted overseas for work, or is in denial about their sexuality. It’s all too easy for the limerent to cast this as a Romantic barrier to be overcome through the power of their magnificent love – rather than a complex problem that the LO has to deal with personally, before they are ready for a committed relationship.
Barriers and adversity can drive a manageable crush into the mania of limerence.
2. You can’t choose who you are attracted to
The message of the School of Life video is that finding unavailable people attractive, but available people boring, is a psychological evasion. That the subconscious fear of exposing yourself to a real relationship with a person that could wound you is so aversive that you instead retreat to a safely constrained fantasy.
While I’m not denying the insight, it does somewhat fail to address the problem that we can’t control who we find attractive. You can’t talk yourself into falling for the available person who doesn’t excite you, any more than you can talk someone who isn’t attracted to you into magically changing their own tastes.
Being aware of the problem doesn’t solve the problem, basically, even if it is a necessary first step.
3. A possible solution
One of the reasons why purposeful living is so useful for coping with limerence is that it makes you more decisive when the prospect of romance appears. The problems of uncertainty and adversity strengthening limerence are reduced when you are clearer on what you want from life, and act on those goals more directly and authentically.
A purposeful perspective allows you to avoid the trap of limerence limbo, and it gives you the humility to realise that, if your LO has personal problems, the responsibility for fixing those issues lies with them. Your limerence is unlikely to be of any use.
Another helpful feature of purposeful living is that it has most power in the early stages of a relationship. Really the challenges outlined in the video (and the objections that I’ve raised) boil down to a moment of critical choice in the early stages of romantic entanglement. Once you’ve felt the glimmer, what action do you take?
That critical moment is a sort of “entry ramp” to limerence. If you feel the glimmer, and then follow it with a learned pattern of rumination, romanticising and building a internal fantasy world around LO, then you are likely to guarantee you end up in limerence. If you instead recognise early on that the LO is unavailable, and resist the temptation to indulge in fantasy (because it runs counter to your purposeful aims), then the limerence can be effectively starved of fuel.
Similarly, if you feel the glimmer for someone who is available, then it is fine – positive even – to indulge in a bit of limerence-cultivation while also making a more decisive move towards letting them know you are romantically interested.
For those who are practiced in avoidant behaviour with available LOs, this can be another moment for self-awareness. If you are initially attracted to someone but then cool off when it becomes clear there are no barriers in your way, that cooling off process could be disrupted. You can’t talk yourself into feeling the glimmer for someone you don’t desire, but you can talk yourself out of taking action when the emotional risk feels too great. Calming that fear and nurturing the attraction is feasible.
The idea is that the soundest approach to romance is a sort of cautious optimism. If you do find yourself perennially limerent for unhealthy people, then it’s wise to be more sceptical of the glimmer in general, but for many other people choosing whether to drive onto the limerence entry ramp can be a more conscious choice.
Overall, it always pays to spend the time recognising your behavioural patterns, understanding the roots of your desire, and then acting with purpose based on your life goals.
Achieve that, and unavailable people can lose a lot of their appeal.
Limerent Emeritus says
“You can’t talk yourself into falling for the available person who doesn’t excite you, any more than you can talk someone who isn’t attracted to you into magically changing their own tastes.”
Maybe, but that doesn’t stop us from trying. Even when we know better.
Song of the Blog: “Take Me For A Little While” – Dave Edmunds (1979)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bFN9mCLOAMY&list=RDbFN9mCLOAMY&start_radio=1
I heard this song at the end of an episode of “The Sopranos” but didn’t remember it. In June of 1979, I had just graduated and and Commissioned in the Navy. It was a busy time. It’s a pretty accurate description of my later relationship with LO #2.
I’ve never been in a full-blown LE for an unavailable LO. My problems with LO #4 really started when she became available and I wasn’t. Her initial unavailability was a factor in my assessing her as a non-threat and allowing me to let the boundaries drop.
polosk says
I disagree about the second point. You can make yourself feel something for people who you are not attracted too if you want. Its just you have to make a conscious effort to do so. I did that as an experiment once. But you are definitely right when you say you can’t just get someone to change their own tastes. They have to want too, and also they have to be aware that they can, which most people aren’t.
Allie 1 says
I don’t think “types” or instant attractions need to spell out the full story. Minds and emotions can change with time and experiences, and a spark can be lit at any point, sometimes completely unexpectedly.
At a university party once, when a little drunk and due to the lack of seating, I sat on the lap of a male platonic friend and somehow we ended up having a brief smooch. He was not “my type” and I was not remotely attracted to him. But it was a lovely kiss and the memory of it lingered in my mind after, and thus my attraction to him slowly built over the next few weeks. We fell deeply in love and were happily together for years. Conversely, after a year of limerence, I once ended up in bed with an LO. He was someone I was instantly attracted to… very charismatic and funny. But in bed with him, I felt nothing. It was an utter disappointment.
polosk says
That sounds like a really cool love story :). The situation and the alcohol helped in that case I think, with the physical closeness + alcohol which at moderate levels helps increase sexual desire and gives people beer goggles.
Emily says
I’ve had a crushingly disappointing time in bed with a previous LO as well, and that is actually really useful as a reminder that the reality of anything physical with current LO may in fact be disappointing despite what feels like the most astounding attraction ever and I can’t stop fantasizing about melting in his arms.
Ironically, the best physical relationship I ever had was longish-term (over a year) but non-committal (I had zero interest, the guy totally did not tick any of my boxes for a long-term mate), with a non-LO. The barriers there never triggered limerence, interestingly enough. There was no “glimmer”, just attraction. I never ruminated or day dreamed. It was just attraction and purely having fun. Gosh, we human beings are funny.
Dan C says
I don’t know … I took this path and eventually married someone who I wasn’t attracted to and it was a disastrous mistake. Even with this compromise, I still ended up with someone with her own set of attachment issues that mixed very poorly with my own. We ended up swapping anxious and avoidant stances over and over again for nearly 20 years. And the lack of that attraction made it much harder for me to want to continue doing the work after awhile. At first I just surrendered to being stuck in a bad marriage until we both realized this was no solution at all.
Marcia says
Polosk,
“You can make yourself feel something for people who you are not attracted too if you want. ”
I don’t agree with this, but I think what you can do is give the people a chance for whom you feel a mid-level attraction. If you are the kind of person who has picked badly based on dating people for whom you are highly attracted (and a lot of people have), it may be best to say yes to dates where you feel some attraction but aren’t so completely blinded. It gives you a chance to see if there is compatibility because you can see them more clearly versus realizing months or even years down the road that the person you were so initially wild about is not someone you should ever have been in a relationship with. It’s harder to pick the first kind of person because you feel a “hell, maybe” versus a “hell, yes” with the second kind of person. Your natural tendency is to want to bolt, particularly if you are a limerent and used to a blazing fire. But in the long run, it may be better in that you end up with someone with whom you are more compatible.
Lindsay says
Yes, this question of not being able to control who you are attracted to. I have come to a place where I recognize that I just don’t get sexually excited about/attracted to a man who makes me feel emotionally/psychologically safe. I don’t know how/if I can overcome this. I can have a healthy relationship with no sexual element, or casual sex with potential LOs and just try to talk myself out of wanting any kind of real relationship with them. Currently I am avoiding dating or going out of my way to meet new men. I’d rather be celibate for the rest of my life than put myself or others through the pain of these chaotic attachments. I’m only 35 so maybe there is hope that this pattern will change somehow, someday but I am not counting on it.
polosk says
The way I made myself feel sexual attraction to someone who I had never felt any for before, is pretty lame and embarassing, but here it goes. Basically in your mind, pretend you are sleeping with them. If you really want to help use a blanket and cuddle and kiss it, whilst pretending it is them. That worked for me in my experiment, maybe it will work for you.
You could also say that you love them and try and believe this whilst you do this, but I wouldn’t do that, it was too effective, kind of inducing semi-limerent symptoms. I really advice against this, its basically what limerents end up doing to themselves by accident.
I also advice against the first one to be honest, unless you actually trust the person, and want to be in a relationship with them, and also it might not work for you, cause I am a different person to you, and the experiment worked for me.
At the end of the day you are attracted to who your mind chooses to be attracted too. Unconscious attraction is probably stronger and better, but I think you can choose to be attracted to someone if you want too, although obviously you have to want too for some reason.
Also you probably know and already do this, but with the people you feel safe with, if they feel comfortable try and touch them more and stuff like that whilst dating, and engage yourself in that fun. By playing with the other person and having fun and allowing them to have fun with your body, maybe it will help you feel sexually excited about people who make you feel emotionally/psychologically safe.
But and this is the most useful piece of information here: If you want to probably have the best bet of solving these issues and changing these patterns, probably best to consult a therapist or a relationship counsellor, prefarably one that has heard about limerence, and yeah relationship counsellor do also help single people.
This was embarassing, but I hope it helps.
polosk says
Could you delete this for me, please.
polosk says
I’m kind of like you in a way the first person I felt a sexual attraction too was my LO (my former friend), and that was only after limerence had taken a big effect.
Alice says
„or get rejected (emotional pain). Either way, both of these pathways should neutralise any uncertainty and so would tend to diminish the limerence”
What if I get both clarity and rejection and I still believe it will work in the future. It is the second time that rejection does not finish my obsession. Even I exposed myself and get some closure I still believe that LO will change his mind becuase it was not true what he said. Still leaving myself in uncertainty, checking his social media and waiting for him to come back. When my logical part knows that he moved on and he said what he meant, my emotional part believes he still thinks about me.
Rejection and even clarity not always finish limerence. I am still in denial.
Kathy says
OMG this is exactly where I am at…there is clarity of rejection and it is not easing the LE at all. Perhaps because rejection (we had both EA and PA) came with an added if we met under different circumstances (vs married with kids) it would be a thing. I am trying to go NC but for more manipulative reasons of him realizing what he lost and coming to his senses. In reality I don’t know if ultimately even if he did come back and professed his feeling if I could leave my life. But like an idiot I continue to wait and am dealing with the unbearable pain.
Kelli says
That is my exact situation/feelings /actions as well! Good to know im not the only one…. But im 38, and my last serious/committed relationship ended 18 years ago… With the last 18 years just spent going from 1 unavailable LO to never wanting to feel that pain again, till the next love at first sight LO walks in….(or, the LO, whom I had known for many years, and always had a crush on, but he was always in a relationship, and once he wasnt, and what started as a mutual LE, soon became the usual loss of interest on his part and he became an intense LO for me). But, the better most of the last 18 years, ive thought it was best to just not get involved cuz i didnt want the feelings….. But now, i no longer want to be alone. I no longer am happy to be alone, i dont want to die alone. This is whats known as being stuck between a rock and a hard place…..
Limerent Emeritus says
Hi, Kelli,
“But now, i no longer want to be alone. I no longer am happy to be alone, i dont want to die alone.”
That’s quite an epiphany. I had a somewhat similar one a long time ago. Now, what do you do about it?
When we started dating LO #2 told me, “My greatest fear is to grow old and die alone.” At the time, she seemed set on making that a self-fulfilling prophecy. She was 28 or 29 when she said it. She got there 10 years ahead of you. Her parents were in a miserable marriage and she had a decade of dissatisfying relationships behind her. It colored her world view.
When her relationship collapsed and she moved out after living with her BF for 7 years, LO #4 told me that it was better to be alone than to be lonely.
See the difference between being alone and and being lonely?
When I came around my thought was I wanted to someone to care about me. I was on a submarine and not one person knew I was gone or cared that I came back. If that sub sank, maybe one or two distant relatives might have actually regretted it. But, it would have had no effect on their lives. My not being there wouldn’t be the first thought when anyone woke up in the morning, if I ever entered their minds again. I saw women and children lining the pier when we pulled in. There were a lot of guys on the sub with people who cared about them and were glad to see them. They had a reason to come home. I wasn’t one of them.
I was carrying enough baggage to capsize the Titanic. Once I came to the realization that I’d have to stop keeping people at arms length and allow myself to be vulnerable, it took about 7 years to find someone and I had to go through LO #2 to do it. But, I did. It took another 20 years and my marriage almost failing to shed the baggage.
What I think people really mean is they don’t want to die lonely.
I’m married with two kids. I expect to die before they do and would expect they’ll be there for me. However, it only takes one drunk driver or a nut a with a gun in WalMart and I’d be alone. But, I don’t don’t think I’d die lonely. I know they loved me and would be there for me if they could have been.
Have you ever talked to a therapist about this? If not, I recommend you do. There’s a lot to unpack. But, think about your real goal. The goal isn’t to not die alone. There are any number of ways to achieve that. Happiness is the ultimate goal. Maybe the intermediate milestone is to be able to respond to a loving, stable, and nurturing relationship with someone who’ll be there when you need them. That may take professional help.
Then, not dying alone is a natural consequence and won’t even enter your mind. It just won’t.
Flashbulb Eyes says
The unavailability of my LO was in fact my safety net.
The longing and projections would never realistically materialise, as long as this barrier was in place and so I was free to indulge, as long as plausible deniability was maintained.
Could I draw out a subtle show of attraction from her without showing my own hand? Hours of replayed and imagined interactions from the safety of my own mind.
Could I feel desired again and the thrill of new relationship energy without crossing the line?
*sigh – what a fool
The mental gymnastics and sustained cognitive dissonance were exhausting.
Marcia says
Flashbulb Eye,
I take it you have an SO. “Right Up to the Line: The Taken Limerent’s Story. ”
I don’t think it would make for a good TV movie. Not enough happening. Not enough plot.
Your post is a good insight, though, into the thinking process but it kind of stinks if you are the person on the other end of the interaction and you are taking it seriously.
Flashbulb Eyes says
Yes I have an SO – interactions with LO have been nothing other than friendly.
I say Plausible Deniability, but nothing ever strayed anywhere near to ‘the line’ – this isn’t a story of brinkmanship.
The plot, as you say, wouldn’t make a good movie, but my limerant brain elaborated and romanticised every smile and cordial interaction, so in my head it was a blockbuster.
The safety of an available person, in an imagined story written by an introverted observer(not quite as creepy as it sounds). Like a writer of serial killer novel, doesn’t have to be themselves, a serial killer.
Marcia says
Well, if you are going to write a novel with almost no plot and almost all internal monologue, one needs to be a damn good writer. I’m thinking Dostoevsky’s “Notes from Underground.” Otherwise it will be tedious navel gazing and the reader will throw the book across the room after about a chapter or 2.
Limerent Emeritus says
But, some stories could make funny shorts on “Lifetime.”
“When the Shot Comes Up Short” – After 25 years a woman tries to reconnect with the guy she turned down by sending him a FB friend request. The guy responds with a picture of him with the woman he replaced her with and married. He then deletes the request and blocks her on FB.
Run time: 3 minutes
“What Goes Around Comes Around” – A married man develops an online acquaintance with a woman across the country. Over time, they develop an attachment. When the woman’s relationship collapses, she reaches out for a shoulder to cry on. Unbeknownst to her, she bears a physical resemblance to an ex-girlfriend, dredges up memories of his dead mother, and his marriage could be in a better place. Over the span of months, they go around and around only for the woman to realize this is a dead end and throw the flag.
Run time: 6 minutes including commercials
Rotten Tomatoes Score: 12. “This one is deader than Siskel (d. 199) and Ebert (d. 2013).
Marcia says
I don’t like stubby stories. 🙂 The new trend is a multi-episode series on Netflix or another streaming service. Running time: 8 hours. So there has to be enough plot and enough depth of character to keep viewers watching.
Marcia says
What would be really interesting is if we got a dual perspective . One from the LO and one from the limerent. I think they’d be like two different stories.
Limerent Emeritus says
Marcia,
“What would be really interesting is if we got a dual perspective . One from the LO and one from the limerent. I think they’d be like two different stories.”
No doubt…
Ever see “Grease (1978)?”
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-z49FiY-TyI
Marcia says
I’ve never seen the whole thing. I don’t really like musicals. Thought I love the theme song by Frankie Vali.
But “Grease” is too light.
Limerent: Was going right up to the line. Too see how far I could push it. Was completely enamored … oh, the fantasies.
LO: Had 5 other potentials. Or saw him as a freind …. but did nothing to stop the attention.
This is just an example.
Limerent Emeritus says
Marcia,
Or, as LO #4 replied after I disclosed to her: “Wow! I had no idea. I’m really flattered and, under different circumstances, might even be curious. But, circumstances are what they are.”
No man wants to hear, “I’m really flattered.” The rest of the response was ok and didn’t it take a gypsy to read those tea leaves. I like to think that had I been available, she might have given me a shot.
For me, I think that’s as good as it could get.
Marcia says
Yes. I think I’ve seen those quotes before.:)
Landry says
Hey, Marcia. Try watching The Affair. It gives the dual perspective.
Marcia says
Landry,
I tried watching the show but I found the shifting timeframes confusing. I had trouble following it. Plus, I thought Alison had more chemistry with her husband than she did with Noah. Which detracted from it for me. But the basis premise was interesting, though, and the acting was good.
Allie 1 says
One of the many things I liked about that show was how it portrayed two peoples memory of the same events such that the events unfolded differently in each persons mind. It demonstrated so well how we subtly shape our memories towards what we want to have happened.
Emily says
The video was quite interesting. It posits that a person (the Limerent) who falls for an unavailable person (LO) does so because of the lack of risk involved. Ultimately it relates to the insecurities and fears of a person – which are purportedly assuaged by the removal of real emotional risk due to barriers. It would suggest that the barrier is actually the MOST important feature of an LE. It makes the situation safe, gives a psychological permission slip to the limerent to fall hard for the LO, because on some level that does not threaten them.
If so, it suggests that we limerents are in fact a deeply insecure and fearful lot. Bit of honest self-assessment here – would everyone agree to that?
Allie 1 says
Good question. My answer is no, I disagree, this applies to some limerents but definitely not all.
I would never make sweeping statements that “all limerents” have any one specific goal, personality type, mental health issue, life situation, relationship state, etc. We are all different and unique. Love is such a universal experience and limerence is just one flavour of that experience and could happen to (almost) anyone.
Alice says
„or get rejected (emotional pain). Either way, both of these pathways should neutralise any uncertainty and so would tend to diminish the limerence”
What if I get both clarity and rejection and I still believe it will work in the future. It is the second time that rejection does not finish my obsession. Even I exposed myself and get some closure I still believe that LO will change his mind becuase it was not true what he said. Still leaving myself in uncertainty, checking his social media and waiting for him to come back. When my logical part knows that he moved on and he said what he meant, my emotional part believes he still thinks about me.
Rejection and even clarity not always finish limerence. I am still in denial.
DogGirl says
“That critical moment is a sort of “entry ramp” to limerence. If you feel the glimmer, and then follow it with a learned pattern of rumination, romanticising and building a internal fantasy world around LO, then you are likely to guarantee you end up in limerence. If you instead recognise early on that the LO is unavailable, and resist the temptation to indulge in fantasy (because it runs counter to your purposeful aims), then the limerence can be effectively starved of fuel.”
This is so true for me and I am 9 months into this LE and about two weeks into this blog. Timing is everything as they say and my timing is way off. I truly believe if I had read this post (and discovered this blog) when the LE experience started I would have been able to see the red flags and could have done something about it. I could have exited the entry ramp or never gone in that direction in the first place. In essence I could have nipped it in the bud, which is what awareness and purposeful living is about. And I know intellectually I still can disengage but now it is harder because too many factors have already been put into place such as my fantasizing, ruminating, romanticizing and correspondence with the LO. The addiction has been fed and now I have to do through the “un-addicting” process which is so much harder than just not giving into the addiction in the first place.