Unrequited love is awful.
Desperately longing for someone who doesn’t feel the same way is a hopeless, demoralising state.
But there’s something even worse.
With unrequited love you at least know how the other person feels. You just have to find the strength to move on.
But what if the problem isn’t that you’ve been rejected outright, it’s that you’re stuck in a complicated state of uncertainty?
You’re not sure exactly how they feel.
Your love is not necessarily unrequited, but it’s somehow constrained.
It’s a form of love that cannot move forward.
Uncertainty traps it in a limbo of unfulfilled possibilities.
It’s a situation where you’ve developed romantic feelings, but you can’t be sure how the other person feels. For one reason or another, you cannot freely express yourself, or ask them how they feel, or break through barriers that are in your way.
1. The types of constrained love
Constrained love can come in several forms.
Here are the commonest:
The first scenario is concealed love. Love that is hidden, deliberately.
Perhaps you don’t want to reveal yourself too soon. Or, perhaps you think the other person is out of your league, or unattainable for some other reason. Perhaps you are just timid.
Probably the most frequent scenario for concealed love is that you develop romantic feelings for a friend, and you realise that your desire is going to mess with the friendship, and you don’t want to lose it.
So, you try and tough it out. You swallow down the burgeoning feelings, and keep playing the role of friend. Figuring that if you keep it concealed for long enough you’ll somehow age it out.
That very rarely works.
Instead, by concealing your feelings, you trap them inside yourself, where they then grow out of control.
OK, second is the related scenario of idealised love.
In this scenario, the lovestruck person tries to manage their hopeless longing by sublimating it into a spiritual form of love.
They try to deny their more earthy, erotic desires, and dedicate themselves to a chaste admiration for their beloved.
They elevate them to a muse or paragon; affirming their specialness but positioning them beyond the scope of a normal, human relationship.
This is like the old ideal of Courtly Love, where devoted service to a lady was the knightly ideal.
Usually, this idealisation is an attempt to both evade the pain of rejection, and to maintain a psychological connection to the beloved but in a socially acceptable way.
Sometimes shame around erotic, sexual desire can also be a factor.
OK, a third type of constrained love is frustrated love. So, this is when hope is initially high, it seems like there might be reciprocation, but then barriers or complications get in the way.
Maybe you are living in different countries. Maybe they are not available to meet you very often. Maybe they want to keep dating other people. Maybe they act unpredictably—giving you mixed messages, running hot or cold, or not keeping appointments or commitments.
So, you’re not getting rejected, but you keep getting false starts. You don’t want to give up, but somehow there’s never enough momentum to actually move the relationship forwards.
You’re stuck. Half committed. Frustrated. Not sure what to do to break out of the rut.
The fourth form of constrained love is forbidden love. This time there are social, cultural, or professional barriers in your way.
External forces mean you are inhibited from expressing your feelings.
So, if you fall for somebody who is married, or is your boss, or your therapist, you will not be able to openly express your feelings without causing conflict and harm.
Forbidden love is where desire crashes into barriers of duty, obligation or morality.
In the past, falling in love with someone of the same sex would have also fallen into this category—the love that dare not speak its name—and in some religious communities this is still the case, of course.
Whatever the barrier is, the most painful form of forbidden love is when there is clear evidence that the other person reciprocates your romantic desire.
So, the forbidden love is not hopeless, but it festers in guilt and fruitless longing.
OK, a fifth form of constrained love is unfulfilling love. This is when a love affair begins, but never lives up to its promise.
A common example would be where mismatched expectations about what love means and what it should feel like leads to disenchantment.
Now for people who feel the wild, ecstatic euphoria of limerence—an overwhelming infatuation with the beloved—forming a bond with someone who isn’t similarly intoxicated by love will inevitably feel disappointing.
So, limerents look for their adoration to be reflected back to them, but they see only warmth and affection. They assume that they are not attractive enough, that the relationship is failing, or that they need to try harder.
In fact, they are just hoplessly trying to spark limerence in someone who does not experience that altered mental state.
Now, another cause of unfulfilling love is embarking on a sexual relationship that stalls out as a “situationship”. Rather than progressing to a deeper emotional commitment, the relationship stays as little more than recreational sex.
For people seeking an intimate pair bond, this will inevitably feel inadequate.
So, unfulfilling love comes when high hopes meet disappointments and incompatibilities.
When love seems possible but second-rate somehow, you end up trapped by the uncertainty of what to do:
Try harder, reimagine love, or give up?
OK so there are several forms that constrained love can take, but the reason that I’m claiming it’s worse than unrequited love is because it’s a lot harder to get over.
Why?
2. Why constrained love is so painful
Constrained love is a dam holding back one of the most powerful emotional drives that humans experience.
That romantic energy doesn’t just disappear by being constrained.
It’s far more likely to escalate out of control into a mental obsession, a behavioural addiction.
So, the reason for this is that constrained love has both hope and uncertainty built in.
Falling in love with someone is very rewarding. It feels fantastic.
The promise of romantic bliss is exhilarating, and for at least half the population, it can be such a powerful natural high that it becomes addictive.
They experience limerence.
Limerence is an altered mental state of intense infatuation that comes from co-activation of the brain’s arousal, reward and bonding systems, until one person is imprinted as the primary source of reward in life.
You want them with an irresistable wanting.
Now, if you develop limerence for someone who does not return your desire—unrequited limerence—hope is dashed, and uncertainty is gone.
So, unless you keep false hope alive by refusing to accept no for an answer, the limerence should fade as reality strikes.
For constrained limerence, though, the situation is very different. The constraints can create hope and uncertainty, and make it hard to take action, limerence doesn’t fade away. It intensifies.
The reward system of the brain gets driven into a state of addiction. Desire, wanting, gets more and more powerful as your subconscious urges you to try and get the prize it so desperately wants. Your self-control is weakened, as your willpower is repeatedly tested, and fails.
You end up accidentally training yourself into a state of addiction—intrusive thoughts, constant craving, chasing ever diminishing highs, and losing track of what you even wanted when it comes to love and relationships.
For unrequited love there is some comfort in the trying and failing. It’s an honest defeat. But if you can’t try, love sours.
Constrained love has no healthy outlet.
It ends up pickled in a state of unresolved promise and unfulfilled potential.
Once desire for another person has escalated into an addiction, quality of life deteriorates.
Psychological distress builds up.
Something has to be done.
But what?
3. How to escape constrained love
Well, there’s only two ways out of the trap of constrained love: remove the constraints or choose to walk away.
Either way, the key is to be decisive.
You have to remove the uncertainty that is within your control.
Now, if you’re suffering from concealed love, idealised love, or frustrated love you could choose radical honesty and just tell your beloved how you really feel.
It takes bravery, of course, but being straightforward and open is an admirable way to find out for sure if they feel the same way.
Now, they might try to evade the issue with platitudes or “letting you down gently”, but try and get a direct answer that tells you once and for all how they feel and what they want.
Now, if, in contrast, you are suffering unfulfilling or forbidden love, you are more likely to finally get relief if you accept that your romantic fantasies aren’t realistic, possibly even healthy, and so it’s time to move on.
Stewing in a state of romantic tension that can’t be resolved is demeaning.
The mindset shift needed is to decide you are breaking out of limbo.
No more emotional constipation.
No more drifting in uncertainty and unfufilled potential.
It’s time to force the issue and find a purposeful path forwards.
Decisive action is the only way to interrupt that reinforcing pattern of uncertainty that deepens addiction to another person, and start the process of recovery..
Great Article:
Song of the Blog: “My Eyes Adored You” – Franki Valli
https://livingwithlimerence.com/if-i-only-knew/
A few related blogs:
https://livingwithlimerence.com/living-with-unrequited-limerence/
https://livingwithlimerence.com/the-definition-of-limerence/
https://livingwithlimerence.com/the-loneliness-of-limerence/
https://livingwithlimerence.com/if-i-only-knew/
Can’t Take My Eyes off You would be another good one of theirs for limerence. Even though her overall attractiveness was what drew me to give her attention. It was her eyes.
https://youtu.be/J36z7AnhvOM?si=Kmj4O6D-SXllMXl2
“Even though her overall attractiveness was NOT what drew me to her”
I have read this article about four times with the intent of formulating a response, and I just can’t seem to pull my thoughts together. I am just going to start writing and hope for the best.
Not sure where I personally fit it. I disclosed to LO, knowing in advance that he was gay and he might be angry. Instead, he is oddly tolerant and we have maintained a wobbly friendship for about three years.
I have tried NC a few times due to the fact that I am in so much pain. He has no idea, because I learned early on that I should not share too much.
NC seems to make things worse. I thought LO was going to do the heavy lifting for me due to the fact that he bought a house on the other side of the country last May. Unfortunately, he has been unable to sell his current white elephant house, which is a very unusual place that needs a specific type of buyer. So he lost that house along with his sizeable deposit.
When the house went on the market last summer, LO got thousands of hits on the real estate listing, and his house was written up in a couple of local newspapers because of it being so eye-catching. People are interested in looking at it, but nobody wants to buy it.
A lot of my limerence has just worn out from normal wear-and-tear. LO has a hectic life and trying to maintain any kind of friendship is daunting. He is so stressed out over business/personal things that he tends to lash out at me, not because I did anything, but because I just happen to be there. He always apologizes but it’s still stressful for me.
I remind myself every day that trying to be friends with LO is not a good idea, but I seem to lack the willpower. NC makes it worse somehow.
The only upside here is that I know it’s inevitable that LO will move away, which is probably best. Also, due to the difficulty of trying to maintain this awkward friendship, some of my feelings have died away. So it’s not an agonizing experience to be around LO anymore. Still painful, but not as all-consuming as it once was.
Note that academics don’t usually define unrequited love in terms of rejection. It’s usually defined in terms of unequal reciprocation. So if there is 50-50 (uncertain) reciprocation, it’s still called unrequited love.
“Tennov (1979) interviewed a large number of individuals who experienced a state of unreciprocated love so extreme that many found their lives entirely disrupted by it. Others have described unreciprocated love as a clinical syndrome (Mintz, 1980; Pizer, 1985). … Wong and Pfeiffer (1989) … argued that unreciprocated love, once begun, may be maintained by motivated misreadings of the beloved’s responses, which creates a partial reinforcement schedule that is very hard to extinguish.” (Aron, 1998)
“Unrequited love is a synonym for unrequited limerence. It leaves a person vulnerable to an attack of lovesickness. Lovesickness may be transitory or prolonged, and major or minor in degree. It may be brought on by a person’s anticipatory uncertainty about getting or not getting a reciprocal response to his/her limerence. Lovesickness may be brought on also by unequal proportions of limerence, for example, 100:70 instead of 100:100. The most unequal match is 100:0, total rejection.” (Money, 1998)
“Unrequited love (UL) is unreciprocated love that causes yearning for more complete love. Five types of UL are delineated and conceptualized on a continuum from lower to greater levels of interdependence: crush on someone unavailable, crush on someone nearby, pursuing a love object, longing for a past lover, and an unequal love relationship.” (Bringle, 2013)
The problem is that many (but not all) people who have written about this have an underlying assumption of a linear relationship between reciprocation and intensity of feelings. One of several reasons Bringle erroneously reports negative results, the other being they labelled a harmonious love factor “passion”.
But more prominent theorists (including Hatfield, Fisher, Aron and Sternberg) have predicted a relationship between uncertainty and intensity, using different explanations.
I was wrestling with this as I wrote, because e.g. idealised love could easily be either unrequited or partially requited.
As you say at the end, uncertainty is the key factor and that makes sense from a neuroscience perspective. That’s why I opted for “constrained” as a catch-all.
But yeah, another example of everyday words and academic definitions confusing understanding.
There are times when I miss the clarity of neuroscience research. Everyone agrees what a synapse is (except for NG2+ cells, perhaps, which rather undermines my point but nevermind).
Semantics…what a concept!
“even though her overall attractivne. was NOT”
Unrequited love feels awful. In my case I feel like it was way worse than the other variables mentioned here because I never felt for anyone like I did LO. A strange conundrum because I’ve never known LO, other than being an acquaintance I work with. I suppose having such high hopes for her and having them dashed upon the death of hope is what did me in. A depression like no other. I’ve convinced myself over the last year or so it will never be, but since she’s still a Co-Worker, I am optimistic about seeing her again..
Not expecting to fully get back on the limerence train, I tell myself I can control my feelings when that happens. However I don’t anticipate it any time soon.
Post limerence, my feelings for other Lady Friends have ranged from intense to indifference. Seeing that disclosure is never a good idea, unless the feelings are for sure mutual. I feel I’ve done a decent job of not allowing myself to become limerent for any of them. So I tell myself to not get too attached. Because the intensity of what I would like to feel will most likely not be reciprocated. Leaving me feeling out in the deep without a life vest. I see no point.
To MJ:
Point taken about disclosure, but I disagree in my own case.
My situation is different from yours in that I knew going in that LO was gay and there was no possibility of a romance. I disclosed because I didn’t want that tension hanging over my head.
If LO had reacted badly, I would have been disappointed but I still think it would have been for the best. I feel more relaxed around him since he knows how I feel.
Maybe we can handle it as well as we do because we’re both so old.
That’s one way of looking at it. I suppose right now, you have to allow limerence to run it’s course. If there is no possible happy ending, you have to ask yourself what is the point? Eventually it should get old..
To MJ:
I do ask myself what the point is. I try to look at is as I would any friendship which I enjoy. Although it’s hardly the same thing.
Hoping that my feelings continue to fade so that it will be more and more manageable.
Hi MJ,
“I’ve never known LO, other than being an acquaintance I work with.”
I think that not knowing the LO very well opens up a whole other set of problems because of the projection – you projected qualities onto her which could not be falsified, you never go close enough to see her bad side, and you indulged (if I may say so) in a lot of imaginative scenario-setting involving your perfect life with her. The fact that she looked so good made her your absolute dream girl. Maybe the degree of your attraction to her and her ‘perfect’ looks made you project a perfect personality to match, one that was really compatible with yours?
I just wanted to comment on this because I think limerence for me has also been about a degree of projection of qualities onto LO. In my case, less physical-based and more on a emotional warmth level (LO is a bit of a crazy enthusiastic teddybear, who *crucially* seemed like he was extra into me and hence gave me a ton of validation). Those are my triggers, your triggers are your triggers.
I do wonder whether physical perfection is a trigger for you? I mean, in terms of what’s dangerous, as regards falling into limerence again. I think it is possible to use what we’ve learned to control this. In my case, I am never ever *ever* again going to let my imagination run wild and project a whole load of stuff onto someone I don’t know. Its the projection and imagination and fantasy-world building that did the damage, not the person himself. Now I know him much better and honestly, he annoys me a bit 🙂 I am so glad that I did not leave my lovely SO for this guy! It was a great example of LO not being the soulmate I thought he was. And the crazy part about it is that I knew it all along but I ignored it, just continued feeding the delicious fantasy. (And using that to distract myself from some genuinely traumatic stuff that was going on elsewhere in my life – in my wider family. Not too different, in fact, to what you describe with looking after your Dad, MJ).
Sending all the best. I am glad that you have never lost your sense of humour, whatever else may be going on!
To Bewitched:
I know your comments were not addressed to me, but I did want to say that you make such a good point.
I idealized my LO to a ridiculous extent. It’s getting to know him that has cooled my feelings. He’s not the charming, benevolent man I imagined. He’s irritable, fussy, and flaky. I am still limerent for him, but his unpleasant behavior has reduced that considerably.
Dear Norma,
When you described your LO “running out of the house like a gazelle” to see you after your surgery, it had clearly made an impact. If your vulnerable and someone show they care, especially if they are also attractive, I think it gets the imagination running riot. You wonder why they care, might they be special? Then the ‘Honeymoon Phase’ of falling in love is so delicious that, if that kicks-in (due to overactive imagination), its just so difficult to deny, when we are vulnerable and need the distraction from our worries and thoughts. I can’t remember which blog described self-medicating with limerence but that was certainly me. I don’t think that its a coincidence that LO came along after your surgery when you were vulnerable.
Hope all is well, there.
To Bewitched:
Thank you for your comments. I am glad you brought up that incident with LO in the summer of 2022, where he showed such concern for my welfare. Tall and thin, all long arms and legs, he moves quickly with the grace of a much younger man.
I started noticing these things back then, and here we are, going back to the hospital for a biopsy. Ugh.
At least I know more about limerence now, in case LO turns out to be even a little bit solicitous of my welfare. I will be on guard.
Having cancer is NOT a good way to get attention from LO!!!
Also I have learned that he is this way with everybody, and once the crisis passes, so does his interest.
This is not a life-threatening type of cancer and is easily treated.
Bewitched,
“In my case, I am never ever *ever* again going to let my imagination run wild and project a whole load of stuff onto someone I don’t know. Its the projection and imagination and fantasy-world building that did the damage, not the person himself.”
Your comment reminded me of an article I read in The Guardian about polyamory. It’s by a therapist who provides therapy for couples who are polyamorous.
This paragraph kind of hit me and I think it can apply to limerence:
“We also examine personal patterns. Some are addicted to “new relationship energy”, the intoxicating honeymoon phase, and jump from partner to partner, discarding connections when the initial high fades. Others approach polyamory as “collectors”, seeking social validation through a roster of desirable partners, objectifying people in the process. These individuals are often already “polysaturated”: they have no real emotional or temporal capacity for another genuine connection. They are chasing an experience, not building a genuine relationship/s.”
I wonder if I was chasing an experience versus chasing my last mini-LO. Because on some level, and from what I came to know (as much as I could have), I didn’t like him all that much.
Dear Marcia,
“We also examine personal patterns. Some are addicted to “new relationship energy”, the intoxicating honeymoon phase, and jump from partner to partner, discarding connections when the initial high fades. Others approach polyamory as “collectors”, seeking social validation through a roster of desirable partners, objectifying people in the process. These individuals are often already “polysaturated”: they have no real emotional or temporal capacity for another genuine connection. They are chasing an experience, not building a genuine relationship/s.””
I think that I might be addicted to ‘new relationship energy’ 😬
I have always been one of those people who was ‘romantic’, interested in grand gestures, but with a bit of cynicism thrown in? I looked hard on the outside but was a sucker for romance underneath. I definitely idealised it. This might have contributed to limerence as I was all too ready to project my imagination at the LO. Like you, I knew what I was doing on some level, and saw that he was not a good match for me, but it felt so good that I just kept going.
FWIW I think the ‘polysaturated’ thing sucks a bit – who wants someone who seems to be only interested in their own ego?? I do not think that I would be attracted to that sort of person at all. by contract, what I think is a major trigger for me is someone who doesn’t stand out, initially, but seems to be really romantic – really into me. God, it actually sounds pathetic, doesn’t it?
I saw that article last week but didn’t read it – thank you for pointing it out. I will definitely check it out!
*by contrast*
Bewitched,
“FWIW I think the ‘polysaturated’ thing sucks a bit – who wants someone who seems to be only interested in their own ego?? ”
I think my last mini-LO … yes, some ego involved (I didn’t know that early on). But also … how much of my ego was wrapped up in it, too? I think some. As I wrote, I also related to the idea of the person providing an experience. Like some kind of human dopamine shot.
“by contract, what I think is a major trigger for me is someone who doesn’t stand out, initially, but seems to be really romantic – really into me. God, it actually sounds pathetic, doesn’t it?”
No. We all have our triggers. What do you mean by really romantic? I guess I don’t trust that. (If I’m understanding you correctly.) Not if it feels like love bombing because it doesn’t feel like the person is all that self-regulated. It sort of feels like they just want validation for their own feelings without regard to the other person or how they’re coming across.
Hi Marcia,
“What do you mean by really romantic”
I don’t exactly mean love bombing, or maybe a quiet version of it, not exactly grand gestures but more captivated, fully engaged, all their attention oriented towards me…
That’s actually been my experience of falling in love as opposed to limerence – its always been a version of that. But with LO, I indulged the fantasy rather than the reality, with falling in love for real, there was no need for fantasy and the honeymoon phase eventually settled into something comfortable. That’s been my experience.
In addition, with SO, that was also a relationship where I felt secure and didn’t need to play any games (which has been a feature of love relationships when I was younger, even the ones that last for years).
I do get what you mean about gathering experiences (dopamine hits), especially when you think ‘life is not a rehearsal, its for living’. But I guess it just has to nourish you too and as long as it does, then you’re going to be good. (And if you dont pretend then you’re not hurting anyone else).
Bewitched,
“but more captivated, fully engaged, all their attention oriented towards me…”
I guess it would depend on context. There is such as thing being so obvious/clingy it’s a turn off. It also depends when this is happening. Too much interest shown right after meeting sometimes can be off-putting. As in: there’s no build-up.
“That’s actually been my experience of falling in love as opposed to limerence ”
I’m not following you. How was falling in love different than limerence?
“But I guess it just has to nourish you too and as long as it does, then you’re going to be good. ”
Oh, no, it’s not nourishing. It’s almost the opposite of safe and steady.
Dear Marcia,
“I guess it would depend on context. There is such as thing being so obvious/clingy it’s a turn off.”
Oh definitely. And 9 times/10 it would put me off, or make that 999 times/1000. But when its coming from the right person (1 time/1000) who presses my buttons, then its dangerous.
“It also depends when this is happening. Too much interest shown right after meeting sometimes can be off-putting. As in: there’s no build-up.”
Yes, I like a slow build as well and too much too soon is usually a turn-off and reeks a bit of desperation. Do you like romantic movies and books? If so, are there tropes that you prefer? I think another problem is that the forbidden or impossible love trope is one that I have probably been far too influenced by. It’s set me up for some expectations about what I perceive to be romantic and what gets my brain chemicals going. Then I feed it by starting to project and all is lost. This happened to me when I was younger but I often ended up in a relationship with the person so it never turned into limerence. The only limerent event I have experienced was after I was married. But now I have learned my lesson.
““That’s actually been my experience of falling in love as opposed to limerence ”
I’m not following you. How was falling in love different than limerence?””
Falling in love was the same as falling in limerence, at the start, but in limerence there were barriers, it could not happen for real and became something that only happened in my head. It was stunted from further development. You know the way you keep insisting that limerence is something that happens in people’s heads – not that much happens. I agree! But, on the other hand, if you are a bit of a dreamer, what can be more real than what happens in your head? Barriers are a godsend for partnered limerents (?). Another difference from falling in love was that, when falling in limerence, I was self-medicating (using limerence) which never happened when falling in love as I wasn’t traumatised at the time.
“Oh, no, it’s not nourishing. It’s almost the opposite of safe and steady.”
Ah, I see. I think that this would freak me out! But different strokes for different folks, as they say. I am sure it makes for some great stories/ memories? Mind you, the slow build also goes against this, somewhat?
Bewitched,
“But when its coming from the right person (1 time/1000) who presses my buttons, then its dangerous.”
I certainly understand that! The pressing of the buttons. 🙂
“Yes, I like a slow build as well and too much too soon is usually a turn-off and reeks a bit of desperation.”
Exactly. It comes off as desperate.
“I think another problem is that the forbidden or impossible love trope is one that I have probably been far too influenced by. It’s set me up for some expectations about what I perceive to be romantic and what gets my brain chemicals going. ”
Because that’s what Hollywood has fed us. There should be all kinds of barriers and our nervous systems should be on fire. But in reality … those are probably things to avoid. The first … it shouldn’t feel like climbing Mt. Everest to get/land someone. If it does, abort mission. 🙂 The second … it’s probably your body telling you the person isn’t safe. As much as I hate to admit that. Because I kind of dig having my nervous system on fire. 🙂
“Falling in love was the same as falling in limerence, at the start, but in limerence there were barriers”
Yes, I can see that. But that’s where things get tricky. Because, with barriers, feelings get more intense. The longing and the yearning grow, and we limerents (mistakenly) think that means much more than it does.
“Another difference from falling in love was that, when falling in limerence, I was self-medicating (using limerence) which never happened when falling in love as I wasn’t traumatised at the time.”
That’s what I think limerence is. The limerent is going through something currently or has past trauma and meets the LO at the right time, the limerent’s buttons are pushed by the LO (not necessarily intentionally), and the barriers make those feelings more intense.
“Ah, I see. I think that this would freak me out! ”
I think the very nature of limerence isn’t safe and steady. A married person who’s drawn to someone else. That’s not safe and steady. It can’t be.
“I am sure it makes for some great stories/ memories?”
I don’t know if I’d say “great.”
“Mind you, the slow build also goes against this, somewhat?”
I think we’re talking about two different things. The slow build … was with an actual person I could date. I like things to build. When I was younger, a guy would get your number. And actually call. 🙂 I remember this guy getting my number (I had been hoping he would for weeks). But he called that night and the next night and the next night. He killed my interest. It was too much, too soon. Once you’re dating for a bit, that’s fine. You want the person to call every day. But not BEFORE you even get on the first date.
Limerence is not a normal dating situation. Because there are barriers.
Dear Marcia,
“The first … it shouldn’t feel like climbing Mt. Everest to get/land someone. If it does, abort mission. The second … it’s probably your body telling you the person isn’t safe. As much as I hate to admit that. Because I kind of dig having my nervous system on fire.”
I think on some level that I quite like the idea of having a relationship that is all in my head. I am pretty timid about too much reality, and anyway, the other party might disappoint me and the fantasy is so much better. Very different from your liking “a nervous system that is on fire”, holy moly, I bet you are great fun on a night out! For me, the anticipation is more alluring than the reality, which I think might also be the case for others on here, from what I have read. This clearly is not tje case for you 😆. I do take your point that allowing limerence to develop, as a married person, is inherently dangerous. And in my case, there weren’t issues in my relationship to blame, either. I don’t quite know how I escaped that, I did try my very best to stay LC.
“Yes, I can see that. But that’s where things get tricky. Because, with barriers, feelings get more intense. The longing and the yearning grow, and we limerents (mistakenly) think that means much more than it does”
It is literally falling in “love” with the idea of being in love, or with the product of your own brain. And, bonkers though that might seem, I still see the attraction, unfortunately.
“Limerence is not a normal dating situation. Because there are barriers”. Yes, and I know that you’ve said previously, post recovery from your big LO, that you never want to be limerent again. Do you still think that, having had the highs of your LO-lite recently? My marriage started off with those highs and I do believe that I am more in the Dr L camp of thinking that high is not necessarily a bad sign. I mean, where that is without barriers, where the high turns bad?
Bewitched,
“I think on some level that I quite like the idea of having a relationship that is all in my head.”
Probably what my last big LO thought. It’s good for me to read stuff like this.
“Very different from your liking “a nervous system that is on fire”, holy moly, I bet you are great fun on a night out!”
Isn’t that how you feel when you’re limerent? When you’re around your LO? Sensory overload ?
“For me, the anticipation is more alluring than the reality, which I think might also be the case for others on here, from what I have read. This clearly is not the case for you 😆. ”
Oh, no, it is. I LOVE the anticipation. And you are absolutely right : The reality can’t compare. Once you actually get your hands on the person. 🙂
That being said … I don’t like anticipation forever. There has to be some delivery. 🙂
And I’m kind of confused how you can feel anticipation if you know you don’t plan on ever doing anything physical with an LO?
“I do take your point that allowing limerence to develop, as a married person, is inherently dangerous. ”
I suppose if the married person didn’t actually pursue the limerence, maybe it wouldn’t limerence wouldn’t be as dangerous. But most limerents pursue it to some degree.
And even if the married limerent didn’t pursue it (no trying to find/talk/flirt with the LO, no texts, lunches, etc.) … then I think it would still pull them away emotionally/mentally to a degree from their SO ?
“It is literally falling in “love” with the idea of being in love, or with the product of your own brain. And, bonkers though that might seem, I still see the attraction, unfortunately.”
You mean you still see the attraction to limerence ?
“Do you still think that, having had the highs of your LO-lite recently?”
I think what creates those highs are barriers. So I’m not sure you can experience them without the pain of it being a dead-end situation. Eventually you’re going to slam into the wall. It’s just a matter of time.
“My marriage started off with those highs and I do believe that I am more in the Dr L camp of thinking that high is not necessarily a bad sign. I mean, where that is without barriers, where the high turns bad?”
It’s not a bad thing, if there are no barriers. But I think the feelings intensify because of the barriers …then you now have someone who is using that intensity as a barometer of and expectation for interest/feelings for non-barrier situations, which of course isn’t a fair fight.
Dear Marcia,
“And I’m kind of confused how you can feel anticipation if you know you don’t plan on ever doing anything physical with an LO”
Its confusing alright! There I was, a happily married woman, who indulged a delicious fantasy, all to self medicated her way through an awful family health situation. I knew it was never going anywhere, apart from in my head. (if that makes sense). LO was a worse fit for me than SO, inferior in every way, but he would have been acceptable if I was single and dis not already have a great partner. My situation demonstrates how limerence can happen in a happy relationship, more as a drug to distract from other traumas.
“then I think it would still pull them away emotionally/mentally to a degree from their SO ?”
It definitely did but I was one of those people who loved my LO throughout and knew that the other thing was a crazy aberration that was never going anywhere. I never actually wanted it to go anywhere. But you are right than my SO lost out on my focus for a good while. Probably only really while I was army worst but that went on for far too long as I wouldn’t let go of it, for some reason (despite maintaining strict LC and never initiating).
“You mean you still see the attraction to limerence ?”
Yeah, I do. Its sad to say, but I do.
““Do you still think that, having had the highs of your LO-lite recently?”
I think what creates those highs are barriers. So I’m not sure you can experience them without the pain of it being a dead-end situation. Eventually you’re going to slam into the wall. It’s just a matter of time””
This is hard cos i think happy relationships also start with highs. It goes wrong with barriers for sure and then limerence happens. But I think you can get the highs at the start of a happy relationship. I jest slightly, but in my experience, you might need to stalk and then capture your person to experience them, if you know what I mean.
“It’s not a bad thing, if there are no barriers. But I think the feelings intensify because of the barriers …then you now have someone who is using that intensity as a barometer of and expectation for interest/feelings for non-barrier situations, which of course isn’t a fair fight.”
I see. You only get that proper high when it is already hopeless…. I hate that healthy love can’t have a nice extended high associated with it. Not sure how long the high has lasted for me before, maybe 6 months – 1 year of deliciously happy followed by deep contentment.
I am babbling now 🫣…
Jeez, there were loads of typos there as I am furtively typing while at work. I hope the meaning is still clear.
You do raise a good point there. I have noticed, the degree of attraction I have to the opposite sex is somewhat more enhanced if I find them striking or more on the attractive side than less. Not that I go limerent for them or want to, but I feel like if all the right ingredients were there and there was a possibility, I could fall prey.
LO seems to have it all. In looks and style of dress. Top it all off with the fact she’s bilingual puts it in overdrive. To hear her speak in fluent spanish is the sweetest music ever. It’s like there’s just no end to how physically appealing I find her which makes every ruminating thought or fantasy that much greater. And then of course a roller coaster dipping sadness when I realize it will never be. Going there is almost like clutching a security blanket sometimes. It’s a madness I wonder if I’ll ever break free from.
So yes I would agree appealing beauty/physical perfection is a trigger.
Brother
I understand unrequited love as I experienced it before marriage. I think (after discovering limerence) It’s worse because there isn’t the “crutch” of said limerence. With limerence there is neurological explanation as to what you are feeling. When someone just doesn’t feel the same about you, the way you do; “don’t see you as more than a friend”, it’s just that simple. You may overthink why they don’t. But with limerence you at least have a reason/explanation as to why an LO is oblivious to how you feel about them. Even if there are no barriers. Or whether you do or don’t disclose. Love can’t be explained. Limerence can.
Hello All,
After a few years of fitful progress, I’m finding myself in yet another quandry in how to manage NC/LC with my much younger coworker.
To summarize, my LO started out as an intern in 2023 and then joined the organization as a full-time employee last year, whereas I essentially took the opposite path, retiring two years ago (after interacting with LO for two summers–in a friendly way, mostly not especially work related conversations), and then re-joining in a limited way (almost exclusive telework, part-time status). I’ve posted on this extensively on LwL from about July of last year to my most recent post early this year.
Yesterday, I went to my physical workplace for the first time since October, and I have not had a conversation with LO since September. My previous conversation with her was in July, which I had previously described as an “earthquake”; this conversation was our first since my retirement thirteen months earlier. It seemed as though both of these conversations were equally engrossing for both of us; indeed, she seemed giddy with excitement in a way that I’ve never seen before. As far as email contact, that also came in spurts, with year-long periods of NC, with either myself or LO ultimately breaking NC. This New Year’s, it was LO who initiated the email sequence, i.e., I dropped my prior NC pledged and again engaged with her. Every time, I make a slow recovery from my rumination/intrusive thoughts, only to fall right back in, and then re-establish NC/LC.
This time, there was a twist. LO was not there at work. My policy is to not even mention LO’s name to anybody, and I kept that end of my vow. However, in talking with my team leader, (who is responsible for work assignments), he casually mentioned that LO was sent on travel, which explains her absence. As he said this, I maintained my poker face. Then later in the course of our conversation, in a seemingly unrelated note, he asked me if I would like assistance from a new employee in a rotational assignment to assist me in my research. I said that probably not, that the vast majority of new employees would not be able to make a meaningful contribution, even with much hand holding. However, I suggested that I could make use of an exceptionally talented one. Well, a bit more background. Almost two years ago before I had retired, and when LO was still an intern, I had given a talk on my research. LO was one of few people in attendance who asked relevant questions; the rest of the mostly young employees stayed silent. In other, separate conversations I’ve had with LO, she’s indicated that she’s interested in research, as opposed to more mundane tasks that new employees typically receive. She’s also indicated this to the “boss”. I’ve said before on LwL that she’s a once-in-a-generation talent, although I’ve not said this to anyone else.
I guess you know what I’m thinking. In fact, I’ve had fantasies of working closely with her for a quite a while, although they at first seemed rather far fetched. Now they seem not as far fetched.
Having said all of this, I realize that us working together would be a VERY bad idea. It would supercharge the limerence. I’m not even sure if I could be a good and objectve person to work with. But how can you pass the opportunity of a lifetime? What if …
Please help me in keeping up my resolve not to get entangled again. So many of you have been incredible supportive throughout the past several months.
I know that these may seem like luxury problems. Some of you have had serious health, financial, or job issues that deserve so much more sympathy.
Thanks for reading.
Hi CatCyclist,
I understand (I think) the conflict that will be involved here, and what’s going on inside your head.
But you already know – and have indeed articulated – the answers to this for yourself.
What possible good outcome can there be if you did work with her? It will just prolong and – in your words – ‘supercharge’ this LE, that has already taken such a toll on you.
Read the conflict inherent in the stories of me and other people who share immediate physical workspace with our LOs. I’m a rare one here – like you, I don’t really have a bad word to say about my LO. But – having ‘lived with limerence’ for this woman for getting on for 3 years now, nowadays I would sell my right arm to have space enough from her to totally quell my LE. As it is, I can’t end it because of the proximity and the constant reminders (I share this as a cautionary tale, not as a request for help on my own situation)
Since you’ve been posting on LwL you seem to have done incredibly well with your resolve and your analytical approach to it and how you can move on. Stick to those guns! Keep us posted.
Hi LaR,
I love the new emoji-ID you’ve created for me! Perhaps I should use it, but I’m afraid it may be too provocative — as in encouraging catcalls to cats on bicycles.
I really appreciate your expression of support — it gives me the strength to continue on my path. But I’m afraid that a lot of that resolve — sticking to those guns — is strongest when I’m in the comfort of my own home, on this site, and occasionaly breaks when I finally encounter LO, and that is the main reason I try so hard to minimize contact. But to tell the truth, even as I’m in theory commited to that path, I’m secretly looking for alternate means to get around the restrictions.
For example, the idea that I have a responsibility as a mentor — not as an official, designated mentor, but as someone who effectly grew into that role. But over the past few months, I’ve come to realize that I cannot play the role of an impartial mentor; my feelings are simply too strong and bouncing all over the place. There is also the danger of subconsciously confusing my best interests for hers. Yet I cannot just cease playing that role abruptly, at least not when she continues to occasionally initiate contact and act friendly, to treat me as an “important person” — her words, if I remember them correctly.
So, my compromise solution (as of now) is to not initiate contact, but to respond only when she initiates it. Now, achieving the appropriate tone in my response is the hardest part. This is where I’ve often failed in “sticking to those guns” — exchanges, whether in conversation or via email, quickly become more emotionally heavy than ideal, the most recent one being after this New Year’s day. I want to achieve the virtuous middle — neither grey rocking nor excessively intimate.
Thanks again for your continued support.
Catcyclist,
“even as I’m in theory commited to that path, I’m secretly looking for alternate means to get around the restrictions.”
I could have written that myself. It is how basically every limerent feels. Limerence amplifies everything by 500%. I get you.
Do you think you can keep being that ‘important person’ (mentor at work) without it driving you mad? That’s probably what she wants. If you can, then do it. But you have to be really, really honest with yourself here about whether you can. Toughing it out by pretending is hard. I’m 3 years into it and it takes its toll.
Hi CatCyclist,
I’m curious how you would finish the sentence that you started. “ What if …”
If you are thinking, “What if we work closely and fall in love and live happily ever after.” That is a problem.
If you are thinking, “What if I mentor this young, promising person?” I like this thought, but it will require some incredible self control on your part. If you go this route, you WILL suffer with limerence. I don’t recall the age difference between you and your LO, but it sounds like she is starting her career and you are wrapping things up with yours. I’m guessing you are at least old enough to be her father. If that is the case, please understand that she doesn’t see you as a potential mate. She sees you as a father figure. Her giddiness around you is not attraction. She probably has no idea that you are attracted to her. I don’t know enough of your story to say for sure, but I suspect she would be very uncomfortable if she knew how you feel about her. Please keep it to yourself. Please treat your LO with respect no matter how you feel about her.
In light of this new development, I hope to see you frequently in the comments section.
Hi Lovisa,
Thank you for your comments.
Regarding “What if …”, that was a reference to the bouts of intrusive thoughts and rumination that I was overwhelmed with last summer and fall regarding fantasy scenarios with LO. In the last two months or so, however, I felt that I had again made progress in having fewer intrusive thoughts and fantasies, after a few cycles of progress and relapse. After Wednesday’s work conversation with a colleague (not LO), I was worried about another relapse, but so far that has not happened, and I am both happy and proud of that. I am definitely committed to moving on from the limerence and strengthening my relationship with my wife. If you want some more background information, please see my first post:
https://livingwithlimerence.com/the-no-contact-checklist/#comment-108193
Also, we had communicated briefly last fall regarding a question you had for me:
https://livingwithlimerence.com/coffeehouse-postmenopausal-limerence/#comment-114742
I am trying very hard to put in practice the principles that you have summarized so well.
I understand that you are mostly (entirely?) past your limerence, and would like to know how you accieved your biggest breakthroughs.
Thanks for reminding me of your story, Catcyclist. I had forgotten some important details. I’m sorry about that.
To answer your question, yes, I feel like I am free from limerence. My biggest breakthrough came when I transferred my limerence from my LO2 to my LO3. When I transferred, I was desperate to find relief from my intrusive thoughts. I also believed that limerence was all in my head and that no one else would be affected by it. After I transferred to LO3, I was careful not to daydream about my new LO. I found other ways to get dopamine. Running works well for me. Running is my favorite mood regulator. I also poured myself into my marriage.
I hope things are going well with your SO.
This is where I think a “good news stories” post from Dr L would be really helpful: a collection of recollections from ex-limerents describing their turning points and successes, to help us all believe we can do it.
I can still feel slow and bumpy but steady progress. My biggest breakthrough was discovering this site a year ago. In the immediate few months after that I made a real effort to change my frame of mind and bat away intrusive thoughts. I still find myself having to do that, but they are less potent and the voices of reason are much stronger. More recently, I found myself feeling less stressed about the situation, and accepting that this strange thing called limerence had happened to me, and not feeling constantly weighed down with feelings of guilt and shame.
I’m not there yet, but I can feel the progress.
Hear hear Cloud,
We could even do that among ourselves – a kind of ‘what have you done that’s helped?’ thread. Where we commit to ignore the setbacks and bumps that we all have, and focus on the bits that have been good. Like a nice collective brain dump!
Thanks, Lovisa.
Did your transfer from LO2 to LO3 happen on its own, or did you actively seek to transfer? Regardless, I am impressed that you were able to move on from your limerence by stoppiing the intrusive thoughts and the rumination — kudos for that!
As for myself, I’m finding that batting away the intrusive thoughts too aggressively does not work; they just return with a vengeance. As my therapist used to say, quoting Jung, “what you resist, persists”. After being on this site for about nine months, I do feel as though I’ve made a lot of progress as far as understanding how limerence works, but task of changing my subconscious desires is proving far more formidable. Therefore, I am concentrating on “doing the right thing,” or integrity as Dr L calls it.
As far as dopamine fixes, my work, or more accurately the feeling that I get being praised for my work by my colleagues, is a huge dopamine hit for me, maybe almost as great as from my LO. So when I went nearly five months without seeing any of them, I had to forgo that dopamine fix also, in addition from the LO. I’m now intending to find a better balance by going into work more frequently, but at the risk of more potential exposure to LO, whihc can keep me in limerence.
It is very inspiring to learn what you’ve been able to do in ultra-marathons. Like you, I am into an endurance sport, cycling, which I’ve been doing since my teenage years. However, I also have significant limitations in aerobic capacity due to hypertrophic cardiomyopathy (HCM), for which I had surgery (an uncommon procedure called a septal myectomy), which gave me limited benefits. I also have balance issues and periphal neuropathy which causes foot pain and affects my gait when running, for instance, and also affects virtually every other sport that involves the feet. So, there is limited scope for improvements, and I do virtually all of my cycling solo, since I cannot keep up with others, despite decades of training. Since work, even of the post-retirement kind, can go on for only a few more years, I’m ultimately going to have to find another purpose — apart from LO or sports.
Lastly, thanks for asking about my SO. She is doing fine, and our marriage has improved vastly in the past eighteen months; I believe she appreciates my efforts to be more involved. I intend to write more about this, so stay tuned …
Hi CatCyclist, you have some great questions!
First, I’m not proud of it, but I made a list of potential LOs. I was desperate to find relief from intrusive thoughts. I also believed that no one else would be affected because I believed that limerence was all in my head. I slowly narrowed my list down and LO3 stood out.
As for your endurance limits, how frustrating! I’m sorry that you have some limitations with running and cycling. When I recover from injuries, I usually cross train as long as the new sport doesn’t aggravate my injury. Swimming is a fantastic, low impact sport! Swimming might not interest you, I didn’t like it at first, but when I learned to do flip-turns, I started really enjoying it.
I’m glad that things are going well with your SO. I’m concerned about your reliance on dopamine from your work. I hope you will find something else that works for you, too.
Hi Lovisa,
Sorry about the delay in responding; I’ve been with my mom for the past several days, who is in early stage dementia and needs periodic visits from her three children.
I’ve also tried to move on from my LO by distracting myself and by befriending women, or in some cases, simply by having conversations with women I’ve just met — for example, at airports, parties, etc. This is part of my overall effort to get past my extreme introversion, social anxiety, and awkwardness. The key is not to get overly involved with any of them, emotionally or otherwise (no boundary violations), and most certainly not to end up with a new LO! The riskiest ones involved the daughter of a former colleague who is now elderly and decrepit. She actually blew me off some 25 years ago (she was therefore never an LO but I definitely had the glimmer for her), but we are now quite friendly in an email-only basis, sharing stories and tips on caring for our elderly parents. The other one was an actual LO some 40 (!) years ago, and I re-established contact with her after a 30 year lapse in contact. This was a risky move for me, because I did not know how she would react, and I did not want to fall back into limerence! I am glad to say that things have turned out much better that I expected — she was very gracious and, if anything, I have an even greater opinion of her than when we were undergraduate students, but without any reigniting of passions. She is far more mature than she was 40 years ago; indeed, we both are. This has helped me to gain a new perspective on how I regard my young LO.
I think your suggestion on learning swimming is excellent. I have had swimming lessons as a child, and again tried it very briefly as a college student, but being a slow learner for all things athletic, never quite became proficient, or even overcame my fear of water. This time around, I intend to get individual instruction. In fact, this is going to be my New Year’s resolution, and invite you ascertain that I make good on it!
Thanks for all of your encouragement!
You shared lots of good information, CatCyclist!
No problem on the delayed response. I’m just glad that I saw your message.
Let’s talk about your mom. I’m sorry that your family is going through that. Dementia is hard, really really hard! I’m glad that you have a friend to talk to about it. I must address some of the hard, but important stuff. Is your mom still driving? You might need to take away her keys. I took my mom’s keys away and it wasn’t a pleasant experience for either of us, but I’m glad that I did it. You and your siblings need to discuss who will take on the responsibility of your mom’s finances and care. Whoever does it, don’t criticize them. Be grateful and supportive. It’s hard. It’s a big responsibility and it’s emotional. They won’t be perfect at it, but good enough is good enough. Someone needs to get power of attorney for medical and financial. It doesn’t have to be the same person. Best wishes to your family as you enter this phase.
As far as your approach to coping with your limerence, I like it! I like that you’re having conversations with women! As long as everyone is behaving appropriately, this is a great way to get your social needs met. Wonderful! Is everything in the up and up? Are you hiding anything from your SO?
Oh CatCyclist,
I teach both adults and children, and I turned down LO’s request to study with me. In my case, it wouldn’t have been a power-imbalance scenario since we’re the same age and situation in life. It’s awkward, because since then I’ve had to turn down other adults so as not to seem suspicious, which has impacted on my business. It was definitely the right thing to do, partly because I would have found it difficult, and partly because it demonstrates that I’ve done the right thing by recognising I have a crush and taking action to curb it. I hope you find the strength to find a way through this. I felt in quite a quandary at the time, as it was before I’d discovered this excellent site.
Hi Cloud,
Thanks for recounting your own similar experience; I hope to find the same strength that you found.
I still remember some of the questions you had asked me last summer and fall, and I’d like to go over some of them within the next several days.
I have been reading your frequent comments, and am always rooting for you.